The $28K asking price is not firm, or I would have said so. It’s just the opening volley.

I didn’t receive any serious offers until I made the Craigslist ad. Ads in Autoweek, Yahoo Autos, 3 ebay auctions, the SF Chronicle and Auto Trader, although cumulatively costly, were unproductive. Lesson learned. Craigslist is the way to go for right now. I have three hot leads who are negotiating price as we speak.

I think that sometimes MINI aficionadoes are TOO close to their subject and may have a tendency to become too passionately opinionated. But after all, it’s just a car. Millions are bought and sold every day. All that is required is a seller and ONE qualified buyer. Sometimes it’s hard to have the patience to wait for that one buyer to find your car.

Thanks again for the advice. I will keep it on file, although this is probably my last MINI. The idea of a turbocharged engine by Citroen/Peugeot, not withstanding Citroen’s success in WRC, really turns me off. I like my little supercharged Tritec.

Jerry

Price Impressioning

What is it? In this regards, getting the price you want for your Mini.

There are stores that don’t know how to get the price that the product is worth. And end up selling it for a reduced price. You may know of some of these places (Stupid Prices, The Dollar Store)

Through proper sales techniques, it is possible to get OVER what you want for your Mini, IF it is properly price impressioned. Often times this is called “Selling”. To the layman that’s all it is. To a marketing/sales professional it is much more complicated than that.

One area that I noticed that would look contradictory (though accurate), is the representation of the price of the JCW. This is where you Justify your price and look like a good guy in their eyes. It is imperative that you look honest (I know that you are, but do they?) An off the street buyer wouldn’t know to factor in Installation when Pricing the dealerships. In this sense the ad looks inflated even though its not. Tell them that you are willing to give them Free Labor then specify what that means. Identify your customer, A Hot Rodder. Your title should be designed to attract them. Give them a hook to look at your ad. Enough information to get them to look, but not too much that they pass on. Remember at this point less is more. You want to look willing to make a deal without looking desperate. People flee from desperate!

TOO MANY TICKETS! HOTCAR! FREE LABOR!

Tell them what is in your car and how much they would pay if they had to make a car like this. People are lazy, they don’t want to take the time to trick out a car like you did. Let them know that.

What should you list in your Features section? Everything!!! Power windows, Power locks, not just the things that you upgraded but also the standard features. Even a free tank of gas! Who does that with a used car? Don’t list your features as “sport package”, “Cold weather package”. What does that mean? List them it will mean more. And ultimately add more value and that is what we are aiming for. Say “Car cover negotiable” this will add the understanding that you are willing to work a deal without saying OBO. I saw an ad that read “loaded” and in small print it said, “with all the standard features”. Don’t do that.

After you have properly built up all of these features, they are going to be expecting to pay a lot because you have built up the value of it. So, that is what you do. Give them a high price. Then drop it down to what you really want. This is the negotiating phase. But still leave some room to dicker.

Move the price down so that it 1) doesn’t appear in the title. 2) Appears after you have justified your price (After your PRICED laundry list of goodies) 3) is not hard to find. Just an example

JCW $5000 Labor $2000 Car $23000 = $30000 Your Price Because of too many -2000 tickets in my Hot Chili Red car $28000

Now this may seem like a concession, but it is really your asking price.

Car Gotta go! Getting a more stealth color Mini, that is virtually identical to this screamer!

This reassures them that there isn’t anything wrong with this car. Do not mention LSD at all!!!!!!!!! “show them petals of the rose and let them discover the thorns on their own.”

Willing to sell at a reduced Price, or Free labor!

Tell them what they are getting for their money. Let them know that it is a great idea. Educate them.

High prices are Earned, not given away.

Move the price down so that it 1) doesn’t appear in the title. 2) Appears after you have justified your price (After your PRICED laundry list of goodies) 3) is not hard to find.

Please take this in the spirit in which it was intended. I wouldn’t have spent the time to write you something this long winded if I was going to insult you. I’m a bit more direct than that.

Picture Pictures Pictures! Color Color Color!

Get off of Craig’s list. Great site, but what is it known for? Value Shopping! Go someplace where people expect to pay more to get more. After all, isn’t that what you want? Personally, I would park it in a high traffic, High priced neighborhood with a sign in it without a price “call for details” Stipulating that a luxury car like this would be a six-month wait. Citing safety, power, and good gas mileage. Don’t say how much. What is good after all? In comparison to an suv, or gas guzzling luxury car this is great!

I am placing this ebay ad her to show an example of a good lay out, but the accessories need to be priced. If you notice at the bottom, the reason that he listed for getting rid of it was something that you can’t directly fault the car for, and wouldn’t keep you from buying it.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=4545969568&category=31861

BTW heres Tirefly’s show car ad in Ebay. Their ad is cluttered and hard to read. Some body had to ask them how much all that was worth. If it was featured as a selling point higher up in the ad, do you think that they would’ve gotten a higher price for it?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=31861&item=4546312278&rd=1

This last one I would just point out the example of the cost of milk. What we want here is to raise their expectation of what they should pay for car. http://www.go-scg.com/Priceimpression.pdf

Okay now I’m ready for everyone to tell me how I’m wrong. That’s okay I can take it. Best of luck Josh ~

Man I should charge for this. This is too good to give away for free. (was that a price impression I just made?)

A number of people offered their objective opinions on your ad, and some pretty helpful suggestions for changes. You have every right to disagree with them, but I think your last post was totally unjustified:

It’s so nice to know what you think of anyone who dares disagree with you. Have you thought of getting treatment for your anger issues? Or perhaps of growing up?

Now that sounds like a flame. Maybe before you post something like this you should ask yourself, “What would Siddhartha do?” It seems that perhaps you are the one with anger issues. Good luck with those.. and with selling your car.

I had no idea a simple request for advice would cause a flame war. Silly me.

Gabe, I love your site and will continue to monitor the news, but it seems I’ve become persona non grata to a few of your inmates, so I’ll just shut up now.

Regards, Sid

To sell or trade depends on your state. In Georgia (where I live), we pay sales tax on the purchase price. If you trade a car in, the sales tax is only on the trade difference. On a $30k car, the sales tax would be $2,400. On a $10k trade difference, the sales tax would be only $800.

I don’t know how it works in California.

BTW, my MCC is an Oct ‘04 build and has less than 7,000 miles on it. If anyone in the SF Bay Area is interested in a well-cared and loaded Cooper Convertible in Cool Blue in the next couple months, please feel free to e-mail me. Thank you!

I’d suggest adding “OBO” following the price in your Craigslist listing.

Have you tried posting your car at NAM?

Best of Luck

“In the end, a fair deal is the compromise struck between what the buyer is willing to pay and the seller is willing to take.”

Thanks, Kev

Get an average valuation from kbb, Edmunds, NADA and autotrader. This usually provides a decent range to work with (low, average and high). The amount of remaining warranty, the quality of the cosmetics, the condition of the car and the presence of a complete service history will affect where I think the car falls on the scale.

Accessories added to the car. If I like them, they’re worth 50% of the purchase and installation price to me. If I don’t like them, I deduct the full purchase and installation price of whatever is necessary to remove/replace the accessory.

Final thought: never be afraid to walk away from a car. Chances are, there are more to choose from.

How does this help you, the seller? Just tailor your presentation to match what I’m looking for. And don’t be afraid to stick to your price if you think it’s fair. Even if I don’t buy your car, chances are someone else will. But if it’s been a while and no one has bought, you might want to rethink your pricing.

In the end, a fair deal is the compromise struck between what the buyer is willing to pay and the seller is willing to take.

Putting myself in the buyers shoes …

I used Edmunds to obtain their “True Market Value” for a MCS with the following options:

Stability Control Cloth Seats Xenon Headlights Headlight Cleaners Fog Lights Harman/Kardon Audio Trip Computer 17 Inch Wheels Auto Climate Control

For a Red 2004 MCS with 18,000 miles and outstanding condition, the “Private Party” value was $20,216.

I then configured a new 2005 MCS at MINIUSA with the following options:

Sport Package ($1350) Hardon/Karman Audio ($550) Automatic AC ($300) On-Board Compture ($200)

Including Base Price and Destination, the total came to $23,350.

Now for the value of the JCW Kit …

It must be depreciated just like the other options on a used car. I’d say getting the cost of the kit ($4775) would be doing well.

I’d have to agree with nrkist in saying “you need to drop your asking price to $25k to get any action”.

*Base S 20,950

*LSD 500

*HK 550

*JCW 5,775 (Installed)

*$27,775

So that’s under $28k. I even threw in the HK! Just saying that potential buyers of your car are probably doing the same math.

Anyway, good luck.

It’s difficult valuing A JCW car because none of the valuing services list those options. However, I do have my invoice for the 2004 car handy and can tell you it was $29,063 out the door in Chicago, before tax. Add to that $795 for the ‘05 upgrade and $400 for 4 new tires and you get $30,258 invested before tax, so I think $28K is a fair place to begin negotiations.

I also have the invoice for my new 2005 car and can tell you it is $33,354. Not even close to $28K.

I think what amazes me most about this whole process is that very few people approach the transaction as a negotiation. Evidently they think the quoted price is cast in stone instead of a starting point, so they don’t even inquire.

On the other hand, I can’t tell you how many people have said, “Well, what’s your lowest price?” Jeez, guy, my price is published. If you think that’s too high, make me an offer and I’ll consider it. To assume that I think my published price is too high (which I don’t) and ask me to lower it without any incentive to do so is not very productive. Maybe they are afraid of paying too much and looking foolish. Well, every day people in the California Bay Area pay anywhere from $2500 to $3500 over list price for their new MINI and STILL are made to wait 6 months for delivery. Now I think THAT’S foolish when you can order a MINI, pay MSRP and take delivery in 6 weeks elsewhere. Plus have the fun of driving it home and maybe breaking it in along the way.

Anyway, I don’t think the price is too high and I do appreciate all the advice. I’ve tweaked the ad and I think it’s much better now, so thank you all.

It’s been a year plus, but AutoSpies valued our car to help decide how to price it to move. Superb. They only charge $100 clams. Well worth it. ;) Really didn’t want to waste time & more ad money, – no fun.

As Damon realized above, – asking $500 under KBB-value his 2nd time ’round wasn’t his proper price-point.

Here’s a linky if interested.

KBB has never felt close to accurate for us & eBay is there for pricing but the dynamics of that market are finicky.

I was selling my Land Rover Freelander a while back, most dealers were going to give me $13,000 trade in for a 2004 with 7,000 miles. I went to Carmax and within 30 minutes, they offered me $20,000. The offer is good for 3 days or 300 miles and they do all the paperwork.

It’s a good place to consider if you don’t like selling your own car.

Unfortunately, my guess is that when the dust settles, between the depreciation on the current car, sales tax, transaction fees, etc. you’ll have spent much more in “upgrading” to a new car with LSD than you would just installing a Quaife (arguably a better unit) in your current car.