No Recaro Seats for the US Market

David Bunting Jul 12th, 2005 Link

That’s a huge disappointment. That was actually one of the primary reasons I have been planning on getting an ‘06.

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Mike Jul 12th, 2005 Link

We’ve got a deposit on an 06 primarily due to the seats. The trans and LSD are defanitly cool, but weren’t enough to push us to upgrade our 04 to an 05. If they don’t offer the seats we’ll probably stick with our current car.

Maybe we should start a petition like they did with the e36 M3…

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Wraith Jul 12th, 2005 Link

this is absolutely ridiculous! i know i speak for a large majority of 06 buyers who were ordering 06’s specifically for the Recaro’s. once again, the US market gets screwed, the same way as with the JCW seats. i don’t even see what the big deal is with the seat mounted airbags. they are what was responsible for my two broken ribs in my wreck, so i could care less about them anyway.

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David Bunting Jul 12th, 2005 Link

Gabe: Based on previous reports the Recaro seats will have side airbags, so do I understand correctly that they just won’t have the airbag sensors specific to the U.S. market?

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Trick Jul 12th, 2005 Link

Gah. Now I have no incentive to wait. Unless I want to pay more with the model year price bump.

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Gabe Jul 12th, 2005 Link

Gabe: Based on previous reports the Recaro seats will have side airbags, so do I understand correctly that they just won’t have the airbag sensors specific to the U.S. market?

Yes, that is my understanding.

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Steve Jul 12th, 2005 Link

DAMMIT!!! Oh well, only 365+ days left until I can order the 2007 Mini

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KevinR Jul 12th, 2005 Link

Volkswagen has been able to provide Recaro seats with side airbags for the United States vs. the rest of the world since 2001. It makes one wonder why VW can do it and MINI can’t.

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Stefanie Jul 12th, 2005 Link

Trick, I actually just ordered a 2006 Cooper and there wasn’t a price increase… Maybe it’s different in Texas??

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Gabe Jul 12th, 2005 Link

Stefanie – pricing hasn’t been announced yet in the US for 2006. Your dealer will most likely let you know of any changes.

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O(=^=)O Capn Jul 12th, 2005 Link

Do I dare ask is it possible to put VW Recaros in a MINI?

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mataku Jul 12th, 2005 Link

garbage..

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O(=^=)O Capn Jul 12th, 2005 Link

yeah thats what I thought

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Trick Jul 12th, 2005 Link

Volkswagen could be moving larger volumes of cars?

But it’s interesting to me that for the 337, 20th, and R32 the seat manufacturer was actually Konig.

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nrkist Jul 12th, 2005 Link

Despair not, oh ye afflicted by crippling OEM tunnel vision. There are plenty of fantastic aftermarket seats available for the Mini. You can even get the very same seat as the JCW’s, sans gaudy trim – Sparco Milano Prestige. I’d imagine these Recaros would be relatively “de tuned” performance seats anyway. All is not lost.

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MIke Jul 13th, 2005 Link

While it’s true that there are plenty of excellent aftermarket seats available, I can’t justify to the SO swapping airbag seats for non-airbag seats. I’m not aware of any aftermarket seats with airbags.

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mataku Jul 13th, 2005 Link

i love OEM. =)

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Gabe Jul 13th, 2005 Link

I’m not aware of any aftermarket seats with airbags.

Actually the Recaros MINI will be offering are very very similar to the airbag equipped seats they currently offer in the aftermarket. Two downside – hooking them up to your system seems like some work and they will be pricey. One of the benefits of OEM accessories is that they can act as huge group buys driving down the costs of such parts.

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JW Jul 13th, 2005 Link

Nonsense – Recaro has a huge OEM operation and there are airbags and US-spec sensors available. The problem is on the MINI end – they just didn’t want to spend the money for a second wiring harness.

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KevinR Jul 13th, 2005 Link

Actually Trick, the R32 was the only car with Konig seats. Recaro manufactured the seats for the GTI 337, 20th AE GTI and the GLI.

IMO, MINI simply decided they didn’t want to go to the effort and expense for the US market.

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Wraith Jul 13th, 2005 Link

i’m more than willing to go aftermarket for seats, but the only aftermarket seats i found that were available heated were the Recaro Top Lines, which are $1400 a piece!! part of the reason i was so excited about the recaro’s was that they were available heated. but alas, looks like i’ll be contacting my local Sparco dealer

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Mini2Go Jul 13th, 2005 Link

Harrummphhhh! I was one who also was holding out for an ‘06 almost entirely because of the prospect of getting these seats.

Now I have to decide if I want to shift my whole plan and get an ‘05 just to avoid any potential price increase. The positive would be that I’d instantly have a low mileage 1 yr old car. :) The negative would be that I’d instantly have a 1 [model] yr. old car. :(

…Not to mention that there may very well be some negligible – even insignificant – changes, as yet unidentified, to differentiate an ‘06. (Let’s remember the loss and re-addition of the boot power outlet, the cowl vent grille changes, the door closures, rubber boot stops, etc.)

As Mike mentioned earlier regarding aftermarket, justifying a swap to my wife is not so easy. Oh, yeah, and the heated seat thing is another good reason I wouldn’t be keen on aftermarket – at least not for a few years.

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Trick Jul 13th, 2005 Link

Thanks for the correx KevinR. Makes sense, it would hardly be a GTI or GLI with “Recaro” on the seats.

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dgszweda Jul 13th, 2005 Link

Why do they even need airbag sensors in them? The Neon SRT-4 with the “Viper style” seats don’t have airbags in them, even though the standard seats do. So I don’t think it is a government regulation. Besides Europe has much stricter guidelines in this respect than the US and they can have cars without them in Europe.

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SB Jul 13th, 2005 Link

Blame it on the lawyers and our litigeous society. We now have some cars in this country available with 8 airbags! Yet we still have the same basic 3 point harness we had back in 1970 and only mildly up-rated seat strength and mounting integrity. What was once the bain of automakers … trying to fit airbags into a car … it is now a marketing bonanza … to show those crash test dummies in slow motion softly landing into a pillow of air. What they don’t talk about are the dead children and small people, the broken wrists and hands (where do you think your hands go when that driver’s airbag goes off?), and broken ribs. They don’t talk about the cost of the technology and what it adds to the price of the car and they don’t talk (or do anything) about the theft potential of airbag units. In my view, whether it’s the lawyer’s or their frivolous-lawsuit clients, or the theives, or the auto manufacturers …. it’s more about greed than safety. For a car company that boasts the millions of different ways to configure their car … one would think an option of a good seat would be attractive … go figure. Give me a good car frame, better side impact bars in the doors, stronger seats, and better harnesses and keep all the hot air bags in the corporate headquarters. How many Nascar, Cart, IRL cars … which move at nearly three times our national max speed limit have air bags?

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Charlie Jul 13th, 2005 Link

Ditto to SB’s comments, Plus…..

Those stupidly ugly “We know what is good for you” airbag stickers !!!

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Gabe Jul 13th, 2005 Link

What they don’t talk about are the dead children and small people, the broken wrists and hands (where do you think your hands go when that driver’s airbag goes off?), and broken ribs.

Actually that’s one of the main reasons for the sensor in the first place. For the seat to detect the size of person and then to determine if the airbag should deploy.

You can read more about the sensors here.

MINI (like BMW) is preoccupied with safety – especially in the US market. They would never reduce the number of airbags in a car meant for public consumption. They would also not offer an option that would reduce the number of safety features on a car.

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David Bunting Jul 13th, 2005 Link

Speculation on my part:

Since MINIUSA apparently won’t be bringing over the Airbag Equipped Recaros because they are missing the sensors, then it would seem the chances are probably very small (approaching zero?) for the U.S. market getting the Lightweight MINI.

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rustyb Jul 13th, 2005 Link

MINI is not going to reduce the number of airbags, because they (airbags) are intended to offset the trepidation people feel when deciding on the smallest production car available in the USA. “It’s small honey, but it has several airbags!”

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Chris Jul 13th, 2005 Link

Oh well, Mini just lost one customer. Unless there are cheap Works factory options or something for 2006, i won’t be buying a Mini.

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Z4MINI Jul 13th, 2005 Link

“Oh well, Mini just lost one customer. Unless there are cheap Works factory options or something for 2006, i won’t be buying a Mini.”

Seriously…do you like the CAR…or just the SEAT???

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Gabe Jul 13th, 2005 Link

That’s alright… I have a feeling MINI will gain a few more 2006 customers for other reasons (cue dramatic music)…

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dgszweda Jul 13th, 2005 Link

Gabe you said:

MINI (like BMW) is preoccupied with safety – especially in the US market. They would never reduce the number of airbags in a car meant for public consumption. They would also not offer an option that would reduce the number of safety features on a car

But yet they are doing it in Europe. Hmmmm! Doesn’t seem to be just about safety.

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Gabe Jul 13th, 2005 Link

As I mentioned the US market is a bit different. Our culture is one of fear and constant need for safety. BMW (as to other automakers) know this all too well.

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SB Jul 13th, 2005 Link

We are a society of fearful finger-pointers. We are scared of every possible accident, and nothing is EVER our own fault … so toaster manufacturers have to produce 20-page owner’s manuals explaining why we should not use their product while bathing in a tub. It is IMPOSSIBLE to know how many lives are saved by airbags (it’s educated speculation at best) … but statistics regarding the deaths and injuries from airbags (especially 1st generation airbags) is FACT. (I am somewhat jaded on this topic as a child in my area was decapitated by a 1st. gen airbag in a parking lot fender-bender) Now we have two-stage airbags, seat pressure sensors, rollover sensors, airbag cutoff switches, mandatory child seat locations, yada, yada, yada. Most Americans eat this stuff up and continue to pay for it. What’s next? Three stage airbags? I say, lets spend the airbag money on better driver education, better seat restraints, and stiffer DWI penalties … the roads will be safer and then we can all have any seat we want while motoring in our MINIs. And … here’s the big thing … look how much bigger the MINI’s glove box could be!

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Gabe Jul 13th, 2005 Link

I say, lets spend the airbag money on better driver education, better seat restraints, and stiffer DWI penalties … the roads will be safer and then we can all have any seat we want while motoring in our MINIs

Amen brother…

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mataku Jul 13th, 2005 Link

I didn’t know some of you were so serious about seats. personally I don’t like these recaro seats in the MINI or in any normal street car. They often look out of place and disturb the elegance of the car.

although I certainly understand if you want it for autocrossing and racing purposes, it’s definitely not worth ditching the MINI over.

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Chris Jul 13th, 2005 Link

“Oh well, Mini just lost one customer. Unless there are cheap Works factory options or something for 2006, i won’t be buying a Mini.”

Seriously…do you like the CAR…or just the SEAT???

I don’t like the stock seats, and I’m on the fence about the car. Anything interesting for ‘06 might have tipped me in favor, but we are getting snubbed across the board it seems.

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rentagas Jul 13th, 2005 Link

I know this is a silly question but why are weight sensors not standard worldwide (as they are in Jags etc). Is there a disadvantage. I have the airbag deactivation switch in my UK spec 04 convertible but surely an auto switch is useful whatever?. Obviously if all markets had the same (best) seats the costs would be the same!

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Z4MINI Jul 13th, 2005 Link

“Anything interesting for ‘06 might have tipped me in favor, but we are getting snubbed across the board it seems.”

I am intrigued. Please clarify. It seems from the other articles that the US is getting lots of new options which are not being restricted to “Specials” like they are elsewhere.

However, we aren’t getting one particular seat. I’m not sure that is a snubb.

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Jim Jul 13th, 2005 Link

I want to trade my “03 JCW for a lot of reasons but I am a skinny guy and without the Recaro’s, I would still slosh around too much like I do now. No Recaros is seriously causing me to change my mind on the purchase of the ‘05. Why get all the power and g force ability and not be able to stay in me seat!

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Gabe Jul 13th, 2005 Link

Jim – have you sat in the redesigned sport seats? They may fit you better.

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Scarlett Jul 13th, 2005 Link

Jeesh Jim–do you wear a seatbelt? I”m small, and I don’t ’slosh around’ my seat.

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Gabe Jul 13th, 2005 Link

btw for all those interested in at least seeing what they look like there’s now a link to a photo of the seats in the story above.

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rustyb Jul 13th, 2005 Link

They are nice (see link for pic), but IMO the stock seats are pretty decent. For the posts that are stating they will no longer purchase a MINI because of the seats–you never really wanted the car anyway!

The bolsters on my ‘05 stock sport seats are bigger than the Recaros, and keep you right where you are supposed to be under spirited driving conditions. Saying you would not buy a car because of the seats, that’s a good one!

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Jack Wolfe Jul 13th, 2005 Link

after looking at the park lane seats I would prefer them anyway, I think they are awesome. More important then seats is the factory installed Works Package, I am counting the days until I can order a 06 MCS

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KevinR Jul 13th, 2005 Link

I entertained thoughts of trading my ‘04 MCS for an ‘06 (last of the model run…). However, with each new revelation about the ’06s, I see fewer reasons to trade. There just doesn’t seem to be enough difference to me…

As to the 2007s, I’m not impressed by what I’ve seen so far and I have very vivid, very bad memories of a mid-’80s Peugeot. It’s highly unlikely that I’ll be buying one of those.

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Gabe Jul 13th, 2005 Link

KevinR – I don’t mean to be harsh here… but what you’re saying is essentially: because BMW’s logistics partner built a car 20 years ago that I had problems with, I won’t be buying the next generation MINI. The first MINI with an engine built and designed by BMW.

I understand bad 80’s Peugeots… but I just can’t understand that reasoning…

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James K Jul 13th, 2005 Link

In my head, I was imagining the Recaros to be a lot more aggressive than the ones in that picture. I suddenly don’t care so much that they’re unavailable. I was considering trading in my ‘04 MCS for an ‘06 and I’m not seeing any reason to rethink that, especially if the factory installed JCW kits are still a go.

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Gabe Jul 13th, 2005 Link

So you’re less interested in an ‘06 if the JCW kits are available from the factory?

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mataku Jul 13th, 2005 Link

In my head, I was imagining the Recaros to be a lot more aggressive than the ones in that picture. I suddenly don’t care so much that they’re unavailable. I was considering trading in my ‘04 MCS for an ‘06 and I’m not seeing any reason to rethink that, especially if the factory installed JCW kits are still a go.

yah, I thought they would look really out of place, however, they don’t look bad at all. But, I certainly don’t understand all the comotion over these seats when they don’t look that much better and i’m sure are expensive.

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KevinR Jul 14th, 2005 Link

Gabe, I’m not interested in the next generation MINI, regardless of who is the engine building partner. The advance shots I’ve seen here and elsewhere turned me off long before I knew the details of the new engine.

The fact that the car will have a totally new, unproven engine designed and built in partnership with a manufacturer that has a suspect reputation in this country (confirmed in my own experience) only solidifies my feelings.

And remember that BMW isn’t exactly ding free when it comes to product offerings. M42 engine profile gaskets, early V8 engine blocks and the current 7 series issues are just a few points where BMW’s engineering fell a little short.

Finally, I don’t have to be rational in my car buying decisions. If I were rational about it, I probably wouldn’t have bought a car whose nearest dealer is 85 miles away.

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Gabe Jul 14th, 2005 Link

Well that rational makes a bit more sense. While I don’t agree with it, I can at least respect it. I just don’t want there to be this misconception that the engine will be designed and built in France by PSA when that couldn’t be farther from the truth.

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Chris Jul 14th, 2005 Link

Yeah, now that I’ve seen the Recaro, I can’t say I’ll miss it that much. It’s not that the seats are a deal breaker, but I just want something special for the last year, otherwise I’ll just wait, maybe consider the new model. A factory Works package changes that though, that might be worth it if it’s not overpriced. From the factory, even with the brakes, it shouldn’t cost more than like $3900, and really it should be like $2500-3000.

I wasn’t aware the ‘05 sport seats are different, that true? I’ll have to go check it out.

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Jim Jul 14th, 2005 Link

Scarlett- We must drive together sometime and I will show you what I mean by sloshing around in my seat. I love lateral g forces.

Gabe_ No I have not sat in the new seats. Thanks for the heads up.

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Erik Cullins Jul 16th, 2005 Link

I’m disappointed…I have a 2003 Mini S with the sport seats and hate them. I’ve dreamed of a more supportive seat and have toyed with after-market, but didn’t want the insurance/legal questions.

I planned on buying the new mini seats and swapping them…guess I’m going after-market.

I’m just amazed that such a good handling car has such poor seats. Why again does the rest of the world get what we are also asking for. How tough is is to install a manual airbag bypass, if the sensor is the problem?

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BAR Jul 29th, 2005 Link

Any chance a petition for the new seats would change anything? I’m sure we could get enough signatures to get the seat option. As well, a question for Gabe or anyone else in “the know”, will the Recaro’s come to Canada? no DOT might mean they could slip through.

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Taylor Sep 13th, 2005 Link

I’m way behind here and just now catching up. I was also waiting for the Recaros, I’ve had them on a 325is for 15 years and they were great, really great. But with grey insets only, I agree, I don’t care for them anyway. I feel sort of stupid that I did not order an 05 when I had the chance – and now the electric blue is gone.

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MotoringFile » Blog Archive » New 2006 Options for the US Market Nov 7th, 2005 Link

[...] We wrote about it last week but it’s probably worth mentioning again; the US won’t be getting the new Recaro seats (seen here) that will be available elsewhere in the world. [...]