Fiesta ST vs MC vs Swift

AJ Dec 7th, 2006 Link

They still make Fiestas? I thought the world was rid of those things.

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DB Dec 7th, 2006 Link

Yea, we just don’t get it in the States.

Notice how it also no longer resembles an upside fish-bowl on wheels. It’s also grown in length by quite a bit.

I see a Fiesta almost everyday and I think it’s a little bit shorter than the MINI!

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Craig Dec 7th, 2006 Link

Wow, Ford makes a realy fast Fiesta Sanitary Towel! Rather unfortunate name for a good car.

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meb Dec 7th, 2006 Link

Hey, I owned a 1981 Ford Fiesta modified with with European engine kits, suspnsion and brakes. When tose dual side draft Webbers were dialed in, it would smoke Mustang GTs of that day – 165hp and 1,750lbs. It was a hoot! The steering was great too…but the four speed stick was a bit rubbery.

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GZ Dec 7th, 2006 Link

Call me a snob but does anybody really care about comparing three cars with the collective power of a sewing machine? Personally I wish MINI would only make the MCS and JCW with their respective convertibles. The base car being under $20k gives the impression of a cheap economy car robbing the other two models of the coolness and exclusive factor that any BMW should have. If you can’t afford an S then go get a Ford or GM crackerbox and save your money until you can. Lowering the bar is wimpy. Ok, bring on the hate mail.

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OH Steve Dec 7th, 2006 Link

Don’t be so hard on yourself. You’re not a snob, you’re just ignorant.

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GZ Dec 7th, 2006 Link

Sorry Steve. So, what year is your Chevette anyway?

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FrankInMiami Dec 7th, 2006 Link

What is it with the ellitist and snobbish cheap shots against the base car?

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FrankInMiami Dec 7th, 2006 Link

And GZ I happen to own both a Cooper and a Cooper S and your comments are the most imbecile and idiotic I have read in a long time.

Go back to your Camaro crackerbox.

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Phil Dec 7th, 2006 Link

Technically, the MINI isn’t a BMW, the brand is owned by BMW but the car is manufactured by MINI, am I right? Just like Bentley being owned by VW, you wouldn’t say that your Arnage T was a VW, thus negating your argument that no BMW should be under $20k (because the MINI isnt a BMW). The core market, I believe, is for the non S Cooper, ignoring this market would therefor mean it would be un-feasible to manufacture the S. This would be like BMW making the M3 without the 3 series base car. I am happy that I have a MINI One, which is the base car in the lineup and not even available in the US. The One has its own following like the S. Taking the option of a less expensive option out of the range would be foolish for MINI and would result in less sales, even higher prices for the S (if it was an exclusive model) and less money in the coffers for future development. Comparing the Cooper to the ST or the Swift is fine, there all around the same price point, all similar power etc. If you cant afford an S, the Cooper or One are good choices, all three models having there own merits, the One is still a hoot to drive and cheap to insure etc, its about giving the consumer a choice.

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Phil Dec 7th, 2006 Link

And BTW, GZ, none of the MINI’s in the range are cheap. Cheap implies, crude, bad quality etc (Which doesn’t fit). There are, like I said less expensive options. I think you need to take your blinkers off and realise that the Cooper S, which is a great car, isn’t the bee-all and end-all of what MINI has to offer. Try a Cooper (or One if your in Europe) before you ridicule.

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05DSMCS Dec 7th, 2006 Link

I think GZ is just looking for attention, everyone. Let’s all quietly turn the other way and don’t say anything to him…

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MINI Fireman Dec 7th, 2006 Link

Don’t forget the MINI is looked at and marketed a little differently in Europe & other countries. It’s easy to see things through our America-centric glasses and make judgements that don’t apply to all markets. To each his own.

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Scottinbend Dec 8th, 2006 Link

Phil……just to clarify. BMW owns and builds the MINI. They aquired the rights to the name, but it is a BMW product.

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Erik Rutberg Dec 8th, 2006 Link

I do consider the Bentley a VW, just as I consider Rolls Royce a BMW, and Jaguar a Ford.

MINI is owned by BMW, designed by BMW, and its factory was built by BMW. As to MINI cheapening the brand, BMW reputation was built on the BMW 2002, and the MINI is the closest car they have to it today. It was affordable, but more expensive then similar sized cars, but the performance made it worth it. Sounds alot like our MINIs. More and more MINIs show up at BMW CCA events each year, and these are not new members, but long time BMW loyalists, that feel as I do, that BMWs have grown to big and heavy to be truly fun.

The only reason BMW kept MINI when the sold the rest of Rover, was for an entry into the front wheel drive market. As much as I love my MINI, and would have been mourning the death of BMW if it was badged a BMW. BMWs are rear wheel drive with the occasional rear drive biased AWD.

I own a GP (modded S before), but have always been suprised at the pefromace of a base Cooper when I drive one. Not everyone needs to go that fast.

Erik Rutberg 2007 550i Sport (shared company car or it would be an M5) 2006 MINI GP 2004 325xiT 1997 318ti/Dinan3, supercharged 1988 M5 1985 735iA, currently on life support 1973 2002

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GZ Dec 8th, 2006 Link

Actually Frank, there’s a Cayman S and a Lexus 350 IS in my garage.

Too bad that someone offers an opinion that you and Steve disagree with we see derogatory (thought that wasn’t tolerated Gabe)personal name calling (ignorant,imbecile,idiot?). Gabe it’s a shame that MF standards have dropped to allow these comments on this site.

Phil dissagreed with me and stated a thoughtful and polite counter opinion. Just because I feel the Cooper would be better served as an upscale vehicle verses an alternative to a Dodge Dart doesn’t mean my opinion shouldn’t be offered. I’m sure there are those who agree with me and those who don’t. Fine. Respond with respect.

Apparently my feeling that the base model lacks class has been illustrated by a pair of it’s owners.

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FrankInMiami Dec 8th, 2006 Link

GZ, so then don’t come here issuing dumb comments that have no substance and expecting not to get flamed for them.

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banjoez Dec 8th, 2006 Link

“Actually Frank, there’s a Cayman S and a Lexus 350 IS in my garage.”

Advice from someone who doesn’t own a MINI?

“The base car being under $20k gives the impression of a cheap economy car robbing the other two models of the coolness and exclusive factor that any BMW should have.”

My cheap, economy MCC is pretty cool, very fun to drive and pretty exclusive where I live. I rarely see perfect strangers come up to Lexus owners to inquire about their cars. I do see lots of Lexotas that all look alike on the road though. And by the way, a MINI is not meant to be an “exclusive” BMW.

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ichor Dec 8th, 2006 Link

call me a snob but does anybody really care about a cayman s? personally i wish porsche would only make the 911 and 911 awd with their respective convertibles. the cayman s being under $70k gives the impression of a cheap economy car robbing the other two models of the coolness and exclusive factor that any porsche should have. if you can’t afford a 911 then go get a ford or gm crackerbox and save your money until you can. lowering the bar is wimpy. don’t bring on the hate mail.

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FrankInMiami Dec 8th, 2006 Link

Cayman = I could not afford the real Porsche, i.e 911.

Lexus IS350 = I could not afford the real BMW 330i or even M3

Cheap copycats, that’s for sure.

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GZ Dec 8th, 2006 Link

Ok my lame whiney friends. For the record I sold my ‘05 JCW this summer and will pick up another in fall ‘07. I therefore feel more than qualified to comment on Minis and respond to your pathetic whimpering when someone does’t share your opinions.

Frank, clever retort. I’m sure your promotion at Wendy’s is eminent.

Banjoez. Lexota? You wish.

Ichor. MSRP on Porsche was $73,000. Dream on.

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FrankInMiami Dec 8th, 2006 Link

GZ, are you overcompensating for something?

I could care less about your wealth and what ever meaningless materialistic/ellitist rants.

Wendy’s? Anytime baby! I am the CEO already.

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FrankInMiami Dec 8th, 2006 Link

Lexota, love it!

$73K for a Cayman S? I have a bridge to sell you..

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GZ Dec 8th, 2006 Link

Yawn. For anyone out there who can read check out Winding Road.com and check out the article titled “Sport Coupe Dream Drive” for an unbiased opinion on the Cayman S. Of course Road and Track just called it the sports car of the decade. Not bad for a “cheap copycat”.

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banjoez Dec 8th, 2006 Link

How’s that old song go? “Lord it’s Hard to be Humble”?

I’m glad that some folks can afford a Lexus and a Porsche and all these wonderful status cars and can look down upon all us poor simple folk that can only afford an economy car like the MINI. But back on topic….

Have any of our European friends here had the opportunity to drive the Swift? It sounds like a pretty good little car from everything I’ve read.

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DB Dec 8th, 2006 Link

Ok ok ok. Now you made db jump in and comment.

There are currently comments stuck in moderation. They will be remaining there until I say otherwise.

If this continues, I’ll close comments for this post for a week and make you take this offline.

There are some great comments here that are productive. Lets get back on track gang! Come on, I know you can do it! :~)

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Crusoe Dec 8th, 2006 Link

My wife had a ~89 Fiesta when we met in Italy. Much higher quality then the US’s junk, it was geared nicely and handled pretty well. I wish the Cooper would be compared with the sub $20K cars more often. Last year consumer reports put it in the sports cars (where it should also be) but not the small cars. It faired ok in the sports cars but would had been among (if not) the best of the small cars. The Cooper I beleived is the best worldwide seller among MINIs since Europeans have to balance sportiness with frugalness.

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GZ Dec 8th, 2006 Link

Oh contrare Banjoez! I LOVE Minis and cannot wait to get another one. I miss mine more than I can say and even though I’ve had my heart set on the JCW covertible I will grab a JCW coupe next year until ‘09 because I can’t wait. I would never look down on Cooper or those who drive them (ok, even the base model).

I offer an olive branch to ALL my Mini brothers and sisters. It’s Christmas time people!

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Gabe Dec 8th, 2006 Link

DB is way too nice… if this was my post I would have closed it by now. The fact that he has given you lee-way here is a good opportunity to show some maturity and end this pointless (and mean-spirited) discussion in an adult manner.

And I remind you, that derogatory comments of ANY kind will not be tolerated on MotoringFile. Don’t be surprised if current and past posts start to dissapear. If this continues posts won’t be the only thing that goes away.

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Mark Dec 11th, 2006 Link

It’s more fun to drive a slow car fast, than it is to drive a fast car slow. ’nuff said

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meb Dec 11th, 2006 Link

The non S or non T share a huge portion of content with the faster models – not to be confused with ‘upscale’ models as was missed in a thread far above; driving a car with a horsepower deficit on a track will make one a faster driver a lost faster than a car with lots of horsepower. Horse power has a way of making up for driving talent. There is a argument for the non S or non T as momentum cars.

…I never thought ownership of anything Porsche or Ferrari or any other make guaranteed driving talent, class, or righteousness.

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GZ Dec 11th, 2006 Link

Just coolness.

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Mike Dec 11th, 2006 Link

I love both my ‘base’ Cooper and my S, and am glad MINI makes both models.

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dz Dec 12th, 2006 Link

Wow, it is truly amusing to read about the Fiesta and the Swift in this context since we haven’t really seen them here in the US for awhile, and they weren’t necessarily considered anything close to sporty! It’s refreshing to know that there are people out there who value the fun and frugality of these cars, and have enough character to realize that they are not defined by the vehicle they drive.

I happily drive the “cheap” base MINI Cooper, dragging down the “coolness” quotient for those who have more money than me. It’s sad that some people actually believe their vehicles mean more than their character.

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GZ Dec 14th, 2006 Link

Is the Fiesta available in the states?

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