Sections: MINI Competitors Jun 29th, 2009 46 Comments 
Yet more MINI competition… this time specific to the US market. Fiat has officially approved four variants of the 500 to be built in Mexico and release starting in 2011. Reportedly we should expect the standard hatchback in both standard and Abarth trim, newly released convertible and a wagon variant. While it may not quite live up to the MINI’s dynamic abilities, there’s little question that the little Fiat has plenty of charm and potentially even an edge on the cute factor – seemingly important in the US market these days.
For those of our readers in the US, would this tempt you out of a MINI? Or for those readers elsewhere, has the 500 already tempted you?
+ REPORT: Four versions of Fiat 500 in the U.S. by 2011 / Autoblog (via Automotive News)
Like Mini, If I was going to have a 500, it would also be a classic. You know, the bubble buts with no grille and less than 100 horsepower. Unlike the Mini, I would only get a classic 500 based on looks. A classic Mini however, I’d get for the experience of actually driving it, and the good looks is a bonus.
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Mk1 Jun 29th, 2009 Link
If the price is right, I’m so there. Least expensive 2009 MINI Cooper at my local dealer is $24K, most are more. Lowest S is $29K. Bring it on Fiat.
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LTL M CPE Jun 29th, 2009 Link
I will seriously look at the Abarth version if offered an employee discount since the company I work for is majority owned by Fiat. But I’m also intrigued by the MINI Speedster concept so we’ll see that happens!
02 DS/W MCS 08 HC/S Clubman
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Yield Jun 29th, 2009 Link
I would definitely consider the 500 as it is smaller than the Mini (but still fits 4 — if barely) and would hopefully be cheaper.
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Valerie Jun 29th, 2009 Link
I’ve driven the 500, and though it was a nice car, it’s just not a MINI. Sorry Fiat, you’ll have to try harder to get my vote! I do hope though, that this’ll encourage MINI to keep working to raise their quality standards.
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Steve S Jun 29th, 2009 Link
I’d like to see what the Abarth is about but only if its the SS as in 180hp.
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Jared Jun 29th, 2009 Link
The 500 Abarth is my top choice. However, if MINI were to bring a diesel (and Fiat didn’t), I would go with a Cooper D.
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goat Jun 29th, 2009 Link
This is good news and I do hope it comes to the Canadian market as well. The 500 is a great looking little hatch (both exterior and interior) and in the sportier trims seems quite appealing to my eye. I have read several reviews stating it doesn’t quite deliver the drive that its looks promise, but should still be a lot of fun being flung about at city speeds. Would it tempt me out of my R53 JCW? Not a chance. Would it tempt me over a current gen MINI? Absolutely.
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glangford Jun 29th, 2009 Link
Very tempting. I plan to retire in 5 years, and had always thought a new mini to to replace the exisiting R56 and kick off retirement. The 500, pending reliability could replace the current mini instead
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zm Jun 29th, 2009 Link
160-hp in the SS isn’t bad. would like to hear how it compares in an r56 head-to-head.
ReplyI certainly hope this causes MINI to re-think their game. Revised styling is on the way, but how about pricing? Reliability? I like the idea of more competition shaking up the status-quo!
Reply@zm: Most reviews I’ve seen talk about the vague and artificial steering and wobbly shifter. I don’t think it compares as well from an enthusiasts point of view as well as it does from a typical consumers standpoint.
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zm Jun 29th, 2009 Link
@gabe: gotcha. my gf is much more interested in the 500, than me.
just watched the top gear review on youtube. it may not get my vote, but it’s always good to put a little pressure on MINI.
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nervous Jun 29th, 2009 Link
Saw this car reviewed on Top Gear recently. Very Cool! I would give it a serious look.
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Rocketboy_x Jun 29th, 2009 Link
I’d say MINI chased me away as much as Fiat drew me in.
So quite a bit.
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gokartride Jun 29th, 2009 Link
It really depends, imo, on why many of us got into MINIs in the first place. For some, the Fiat 500 will offer serious competition. For me, the Yaris with it’s direct steering and tight turning radius did it. I’d watch out for Toyota’s iQ as well (mentioned in previous Aston Martin article). In the end, all these cars come with the right safety equipment now, and many are reasonably priced. In the end, some of these cars even capture certain aspects of essential Mini-ness better than what BMW’s MINI has evolved into.
I think MINI will contunue to succeed, but the world of small micro cars is getting very interesting indeed. I hope we can all enjoy this as it develops.
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C4 Jun 29th, 2009 Link
MINI can’t afford to fall sleep at the wheel. The Fiat 500 Abarth SS, turbo charged, 160HP and 500 pounds lighter than a bone stock R56 S has the potential to offer serious competition to the heavier and more expensive ‘MINI”.
Competition is good and the 500 will manage to take away some sales from MINI.
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Philip Derkum Jun 29th, 2009 Link
My ‘79 Fiat was a piece of @#$%^. They will need to prove themselves before I get interested.
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bee1000 Jun 29th, 2009 Link
The 135hp Abarth, if a few grand less than a similar Cooper, would get attention from me if its reliability were proven at least equal Mini’s.
The next Mini (2013?) is likely to be a major improvement over the R56 given the competition it will face. I look forward to small cars being like full-size pick-ups, where each year one company launches a new model that leap-frogs the competition with constant improvement and new features.
Interesting that the article states the cars will be sold “under the Fiat banner” as opposed to being rebadged as something else.
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Veggivet Jun 29th, 2009 Link
@bee1000-
If you believe JD Power, it would be hard to be worse than MINI’s reliablity, as they came in dead last in the most recent survey.
ReplyPretty sure I will trade the Clubman in for one + a used Forester or the like for hauling things.
I love the MINI but looking forward to something new. The only thing I would miss is the community but I am sure there will be strong one springing up around the 500 as well.
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Fred Jun 29th, 2009 Link
To compete with MINI for my attention, Fiat would need to take 30 mph crosswinds as if the air was calm, get at least 37 mpg at 70 mph (or 44 mpg at 55 mph), feel rock-steady when maneuvering on the Interstate, charge in a straight line on snow-packed roads, give me good lower-back support, and make me feel secure when surrounded and looking up at roaring 18-wheelers with tires taller than my eye-line.
The MINI takes these things in stride. It is my only car, so it has to keep me safe, happy, and envigorated, whether cruising 2,000 miles across the country, or zipping across town for bagels.
Can a Fiat do this? Can it make me smile? I will be glad to give one a test drive. I haven’t found any other car that has MINI’s characteristics, but I have an open mind.
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greg Jun 29th, 2009 Link
Competition is good and Mini has plenty of it. I just saw the Nisan 370 Z NISMO. 350 HP and baaaaaad ass(0-60 4.5) @ $39k! I paid that much for my 210 hp JCW. Are you paying attention Mini???
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JonPD Jun 29th, 2009 Link
Dare I say this on Motoringfile…..
The 500 spanks Mini in one major area. Uniqueness
Mini’s are seem so often that it has literally been many years since the last person took a hard second look at my Mini. Mini is not a Civic of course but due to the impressive sales they have had they are much less as much of a statement by the driver. I think Fiat(Europe’s 2008 Car of the Year) has a excellent chance of coming in and taking a good bite out of Mini.
Lets see, Fiat is bringing direct competition to the Mini platform. Meanwhile Mini is trying to compete with a myriad of manufactures making a micro SUV. Which has driven a spike into the heart of its community pretty much evenly splitting it. I personally would drive a Abarth SS any day over anything made by Mini recently.
One note Edmunds reported ” Inside Line has learned it won’t be built in Mexico, as had been speculated, but at one of Chrysler’s own U.S. plants, possibly the one in Belvidere, Illinois.”
ReplyI’d look, as I’ve stated here, but I think it has two strikes already… FIAT and Chrysler maybe a 3rd if made in Mexico. I did sit in one in Holland recently and found the quality very good, nice seats and I like the size and looks. Thanks Frank… another winner! Maybe MINI could get Frank back? An ABARTH would be the only one I’d consider.
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dc11 Jun 29th, 2009 Link
fiat has always been horrible for reliability. then again, mini isnt much better either. with either case, competition is definitely nice for the consumer, as this will hopefully wake Mini up and their ridiculous pricing scheme to “benefit the consumer” by allowing all those “customization opportunities” at a horribly inflated price
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viley Jun 29th, 2009 Link
My main concern has become reliability. I can say that I wouldn’t mind a Clubman but the prices are getting too up there. I’ll just keep an eye on this. Altought the one strike the 500 has in my book is the interior. Feels too… sterile and almost uninviting…
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Eliot R. Jun 29th, 2009 Link
Four words: Torsen-beam rear suspension.
That alone keeps a MINI in my garage.
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JP Dunphy Jun 29th, 2009 Link
see… this is a good move for them… but there’s only one problem, mini’s already better established here. the Fiat 500 is a nice car, very mini-esque, but let’s face it, it’s NOT a MINI!!! not as customizable, not as american friendly, and (god forbid) i don’t think most americans would buy it as readily as a mini… unless gas prices soar…
ReplyI would think about it. seeing what Mini is doing to the brand (clubman, small suv??@@#^&) I think its good that we have a little competition in the states unless mini brings back the r53 and ends this whole suv craze Fiat may have my vote (ide have to sit in one though)
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JonPD Jun 29th, 2009 Link
Still no doubt that the likes of the Fiat 500 have bit into Mini’s market in Europe already. For all that Mini is its true that the car is readily becoming the middle of the road car. There is a large market for a car that is cheaper than a Mini and that has loads of unique character. Now just waiting for the Ford Focus RS to make it state side so there will be a great little car that is cheaper, lighter, smaller than a MINI and a car that wads up the boorish performance of a JCW Mini as being somewhat less than a joke.
A rather harsh thing to say about a car and brand I adore but keep hoping that Mini will realize it has somewhat loss its way in the automotive world.
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SFRedMCc Jun 30th, 2009 Link
If you click on the 4th option in the article, the “station wagon”, it links to an Alfa Romeo Kamal Concept and not a Fiat. It is a nice looking car, however. Does anyone know if Fiat’s or Alfa Romeo’s terrible reliability records have gotten any better since that basically forced them to stop exporting to the USA many years ago? Chrysler’s reliability record isn’t much better. Sounds like a failed marriage waiting to happen.
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viley Jun 30th, 2009 Link
Bring the MINI One and D and we’ll all be much happier. The One can compete with the 500 price wise.
ReplyHey guys!!!
I live in Japan and I’ve been seeing 500s here and there lately. Actually a pretty sweet little car. I went to test drive one out of curiosity, but haven’t found a dealer in Kansai that has a demo vehicle yet. (Only checked 2 dealers so far and both are on posh, busy streets in Osaka.)
Still love my MINI though!!!
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Mk1 Jun 30th, 2009 Link
SFRedMCc, from what I’ve heard from friends who live in Europe, Fiat’s old poor reliability rep. of 30 yrs ago is long-gone – but still “average”. Though Car Mags still ilke to bash Fiat, they say the Panda, which the 500 is based on, has a very good reputation, with years on the road – so much so that they are the preferred car for European police departments. Much better rep. than MINI’s. The Panda also has a 4×4 version, which may make it into the 500 line very soon as well.
Replyalready pretty much decided that my mini will be mine forever in some way shape or form, but will be sharing driveway space with an audi or a scirocco in a few years, god willing i can afford to do so after college is over. that leaves little room for a third euro hatch in the driveway, as much as i love them, i can’t justify owning 3. however, it is cool to finally see the nuova cinquecento coming to the states, it’ll be nicer to look at than the new beetle, and the abarth version looks like it’s going to be a blast to drive.
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Evan Jun 30th, 2009 Link
I’ll test drive for sure. I think the Fiat 500 will be a little too little based on pics next to the MINI. Based on all of the reviews, it’s not a bad drive but not quite as refined and hunkered down on the road as the MINI is. The MINI will loose sales to those who buy on the “cuteness factor” alone, not just the driving experience. I don’t forsee tons of 500s on the roads here, maybe 20-30k units/year.
Reliability-wise Fiat and Alfa Romeo are much, much better, now average in Europe. If it’s the Mexico plant that used to make the PT Cruiser, that car had excellent reliability, so the 500 would have a reasonable shot. Overall, most modern cars have pretty good reliability these days.
Let’s hope for some awesome classic changes and a little more redialing in of the R50/R53 into the next gen Coopers….
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JonPD Jun 30th, 2009 Link
Still hits me rather funny listening to people talk about Fiat’s quality, most of you need to go spend time in classic Mini’s to realize the British were not far behind. Add to this the view of the JD Powers survey says maybe a couple of those ghosts still wander around in the closets at Mini.
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M_POWER Jun 30th, 2009 Link
JonPD (and others),
You are absolutely correct about reliability of old british cars, but what was really reliable in those days? MB probably and only handful of others. FIAT today is still a FIAT, no getting away from it, they’ve been making crappy cars through 1970s, 80s, 90s, even very recently. Mini was unreliable, but MINI to me, other than some style cues and a bit (ever decreasing one) of same philosophy regarding handling and size, has very little to do with Mini of old, mechanically nothing at all-it is a BMW. I’ll take BMW quality over FIAT’s any day, thank you very much.
I agree 100% with Gabe’s comment. 500 will grab some portion of customers who would otherwise go to MINI. Enthusiasts will stick with MINI until Alfa brings MiTo GTA (when?) or Renault brings Clio Renaultsport (probably never).
The fact that 500 will be built in US and Mexico is not helping 500’s case. I’d prefer EU built car. We all know what happens with Mexican VW’s. As far as Illinois built ones, I know it will help Chrysler and its workers keep their jobs, but come one, those are probably the guys that have been assembling Neon’s and similar garbage until recently….At least initially, I suspect quality will be a major issue.
As far as MINI coming last in that JDP poll…. I personally despise such publications. The reason: the punch-line is always in the table and the title of the article. Then you read through the auxiliary material published along the table which describes details of how the data was gathered and how it was processed, which are, mind you, necessary, pretty much required, in order to be able to interpret the table itself, and then you realize it means something completely different from what you though initially. What is initial quality anyways? All I care is how the car fares after 4 or 5 years of ownership, that’s what matters. I remember Hyndai Sonta was winner of these initial quality polls for several years a while pack and those cars now both look pitiful and are piles of junk.
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JonPD Jun 30th, 2009 Link
I would take a MiTo GTA over anything ever produced by Mini any day. I also concur with Clarkson’s review when he said he prefers the 500 design over the current Mini design. High point for the Mini design for me was Frank’s initial design so not to surprising that I will take the design of the 500 (another Frank design) over what is hands down one of the worse interiors of any similar car. The interior design of the 500 is light years ahead of the current R56 (and R53 imo), lets hope that the 2010 mid-phase design addresses this.
I believe that the timing of the R56 redesign is crucial to Mini staying competitive with the likes of the 500. Add to this the possibility of the Focus RS and MiTo GTA coming to the states I think Mini will have to be careful to not see the same thing happen to their sales here that have been going on in Europe.
ReplyMy wife saw the piece on the car on Top Gear and is very interested in this to replace her 2004 MCa down the road, but she’s waiting for the 2010 refresh before deciding.
Key for me — will my portly 6′2″ frame fit in it the way it does in a MINI? If not, she can’t have it. :-)
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Dr Obnxs Jul 2nd, 2009 Link
I’d think about it for sure, but there’s competition in my driveway as well. And for those of you that think tosion (not Torsen) suspension aren’t any good, just ask Porshe, who used it in the 924, 944 and 928 (probably some more as well).
As someone who mods cars, I’m not that concerned with a couple of shortcomings on a stock package, I’ll just change it anyway…
The presence of the Fiat will squeeze Mini for sure. I have a driving enthusiast friend who got a Fit, not because it was the best driving dynamic (he’s got a motorcycle and a Subie STI for the sporty drives) but because he got four doors at about $5k-$7k less than a base Clubbie.
Minis costs are high for what you get unless you really decontent the car (read almost no options). Like others have posted (even my best motoringfile buddy Greg, at least on this point we agree), there are lots of other really fun cars that hit the price point of Minis as sold that have to make many buyers think “What about that (fill in the blank)?”
I’ve owned a Fiat before (76 124 sport spider) and it was totally a blast. Yes I had to work on it, but I would have had to work on an MGB as well. And the Fiat had better overall technology in it.
Matt
ReplyI’d go for it since I liked the interior and design. I’d say that I’d convert it to a two seater first since the back is too small. Seen this at CES’09 with Microsoft showing it off.
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CuMe Jul 12th, 2009 Link
i’ll definetly look at the faboulous new 5oo!!!
and for those who think it’s less personalizable then the mini…u can configure a lot more than 500 different 5oos with colors, stickers, wheels, seats, Poltrona Frau leather, etc… it’s really a great car and even if it’s small it get 5stars in euro ncap tests, it has 7 airbags standard and lots of options in the base model, lots more than the mini…costing at least 6/7000$ less than a mini…
maybe u can’t compare a normal 5oo to a mini for its motor options, but for that there’s the ABaRTh wich even having less hp is lighter too.
and for the Quality…do u really think that in more than 30y nothing has changed??? Fiat now sells in Europe lots of top selling cars like the panda, the Grande Punto and naturally the 5oo! And by reviews of european magazines there’s no car with the same quality that the 5oo in its category, including the mini…!!!
if the mexico and usa plants will manage to keep the quality on the europe-level i think it’ll be a huge success in us like in europe
it’s cheaper, smaller but big enough to stay in 4 better than in the mini, and charmier: so why people shouldn’t buy it? it’s really a great car!
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