Comments on: MINI Crossover Spotted in California

By: Axel

Axel — Thu, 16 Jul 2009 14:32:15 +0000

Well my friends a lot of good insight to this new vehicle, but remember when Mini came out in 02, this is same way the Porsche Cayene came out, DIFFERENT from the PACk, therefore Mini is coming out AGAIN different from the pack and it was hihgly critizied then, look at it now, one the best vheicles out there. Lets give it a chance but I want it with the 123d 2 liter DIESEL engine in it!!!

By: goat

goat — Tue, 14 Jul 2009 16:32:38 +0000

@ C4 – I just call it like I see it / drive it. :)

By: JonPD

JonPD — Tue, 14 Jul 2009 11:55:25 +0000

Wonder if MiniUSA or either of my local dealers will be sending me an invite to come see the R60 ;)

By: C4

C4 — Tue, 14 Jul 2009 10:49:20 +0000

@Gabe:

Sure Gabe.

By: C4

C4 — Tue, 14 Jul 2009 10:46:10 +0000

@777:

Thank you, sir. My sentiments exactly.

By: C4

C4 — Tue, 14 Jul 2009 10:42:37 +0000

@goat: Fantastic post, Goat.

By: C4

C4 — Tue, 14 Jul 2009 10:41:56 +0000

@Chad:

Thank you Chad. You are the voice of reason. Another free thinking American that doesn't drink the corporate "Koolaid".

By: C4

C4 — Tue, 14 Jul 2009 10:30:51 +0000

@Volkan:

C4 is still here my friend, thanks for asking. :)

I am the nemesis of the fanbois in this site and I LOVE IT!

By: Aussom

Aussom — Tue, 14 Jul 2009 00:37:40 +0000

It’s good to see this vehicle quickly approaching official release. Can’t wait for the model to hit the showrooms and receiving an invitation to see the official local dealer launch for a good look-over and test drive. MINI’s vehicles are always interesting. Will be interested in assessing its off-road capability, power and economy. Make sure you have your details registered with MINI to receive an official invite!

By: goat

goat — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 18:34:12 +0000

Like others, I have watched the comments on this thread with interest. I do not agree with the sheer number of apologies being proffered for this vehicle by various commenters. On the other hand, I do think it a good idea, particularly now that the car is essentially complete and “coming soon”, to wait and see before passing final judgment on its aesthetics, handling, power-to-weight, or utility. If I can add just one item for thought: I feel there would be less criticism of the R60, and BMW apologists’ counterpoints would be more reassuring, if the R56 as the core product of the MINI brand was a better resolved sporting vehicle. My observation is that MINI has let down the driving enthusiast portion of their client base several times over the past few years and this has resulted in the mistrust we are seeing of BMW’s ability to design vehicles that should be wearing the MINI badge.

By: JonPD

JonPD — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 13:14:11 +0000

Robbie I don't claim to be any sort of a expert on SUV's but at the time of the Cayenne can you name another SUV that was built on a high horsepower platform with a tuned suspension? The closet thing I can think of as completion for that was likely to be the new X6 M. Meanwhile Mini is building a Micro SUV that is build for a family of 4, and to me really doesn't solve any solutions other than being small. Guess it might have a market there but at least the Cayenne had many years of unmolested sales and if you spend anytime looking at what is being developed the Micro SUV is a popular area for many manufactures.

Aarnon I do hear you, and I do honestly know a lot a smart people at BMW/Mini have looked at their business model and decided this was a growth sector for them. However I would point out history which is a collection of smart people that make bad decisions. Time will tell if Mini can figure a way out to heal its community, which I think anybody can agree is still unsettled over this development.

By: Aaron

Aaron — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 06:46:38 +0000

Forgot to add: MINI isn’t throwing away a portion of their core business. The coupe, convertible and clubman will still be produced. I’m not sure how the development of the R60 can be considered as a sign that MINI is going to jettison their core business.

By: Aaron

Aaron — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 06:36:56 +0000

I hear what you’re saying, JonPD, and I know where you’re coming from…asking where do we draw the line. I just don’t think a four-seat, four door vehicle is necessarily crossing the line. I understand that you disagree. I know some folks are disappointed with how MINI is spending it’s development $$, but there’s little to be done about that. If you told me the R60 was a two-seat roadster, I might agree that that is more fitting within the concept of the brand than this SUV is, but on the other hand, I’d say that I think that’s a waste of developmental $$ because MINI already has a practicality issue and adding another “impractical” car to the stable would potentially lock in that perception of the brand.

By: robble

robble — Mon, 13 Jul 2009 06:22:37 +0000

Still not sure how a manufacturer building a completely unique SUV compares to Mini making a slight smaller Rav4?

so a Cayenne is completely unique from the other SUVS on the road, but a R60 is just another RAV 4? :rolleyes:

That's one of the dumbest comments I've read yet.

By: JonPD

JonPD — Sun, 12 Jul 2009 21:33:22 +0000

Well Aaron there was and still is a bit of a schism in the Porsche Owners group from the Cayenne, though likely still less than the old air cooled group. No doubt that it helped Porsche. Still not sure how a manufacturer building a completely unique SUV compares to Mini making a slight smaller Rav4? Mini has created NOTHING new or unique with this. Manufactures around the world have also been looking at the Micro SUV concept so given the release date of the R60 will be all that small or lite.

I for one believe the R60 will be a decent build, I just think its not one that's all that great for the brand. So Aaron if tomorrow comes around that you find out you have twins on the way then Mini should ignore you? Yes I know that small families outgrown the Coupe and Clubman, but just because a market (one of the most hotly competitive ones out there btw) doesn't mean Mini should build for it. With the idea were do you draw the line on whats a Mini??

If you have a family of 6 or 8 tomorrow should Mini build a car to keep you in the brand? I can tell you one thing for certain already, with the four seat arrangement of the R60 vs the X1 5 seat I am betting more than a small share will be looking at that one additional seat. I have no issues with small families I just feel Mini should concentrate its efforts where is makes a large percentage of its profit from. New business if great but throwing away a portion of your core business is an interesting concept

By: Aaron

Aaron — Sun, 12 Jul 2009 19:14:22 +0000

Interesting. Did the Cayenne change people's perception of what a Porsche is? I think a lot of people are going to be surprised when the R60 hits dealerships and people can take it for a test drive. I'm sure it won't be for everybody, but it seems people are making so many assumptions about this car without any information/details to back up those assumptions: That it will be sluggish. That it will lumber around the turns, etc. Maybe I missed it, but I doubt the R60 will be powered by the same engine that's in the coupe and clubmans. I'm sure MINI will power it up a bit to compensate for the added mass.

To me, Mini had a much larger departure from its brand history with the BMW version (the MINI) than this R53/56 to R60 evolution. MINI recently established a new brand image (during this decade). They're building on it and letting it evolve. For those that say the development of the R60 is ruining the brand image, I say that a stagnant brand image is a greater danger. Yeah, a roadster would be nice, but MINI doesn't really need to put out another small 2-seater vehicle at the moment. In the long-term view of expanding their brand image, putting out a two seater first before a four-door would really be pushing the brand into a tighter corner. Don't worry, they'll come back with the roadster after the R60 and then the R60 won't be such a "brand weakening" car after all, but a brand-building one.

Who knows, maybe the R60 will be crap. But maybe it will be ok. I am just excited to see how it turns out, either way...and maybe I'll put it on the list of potential new cars to purchase as my wife and I start planning on a second child.

Back when I was in grad school, I had tons of time and played online games like Everquest, Asheron's Call, etc. Now I don't have time, and I don't play any video games. I got my MCS after grad school when I was still engaged to be married. Now I'm married, with a kid and if MINI doesn't come up with an upgrade for me, they'll lose me as a customer, just like video games (in general) lost me as a customer. MINI wants people like me to stay in the game, and they want to give people who always loved MINIs but couldn't see the practicality of them a new way "in" to the brand. Can't fault them for trying.

By: JonPD

JonPD — Sun, 12 Jul 2009 18:00:38 +0000

Just as blind as complete blindsided acceptance of every choice made by Mini is Bavarian.

At the end of the day i can say I only expect this to change the perception about what a Mini is. I feel than this may be a negative move but then again I don't proclaim any sort of insight or genius about what the future holds. I only see the great amount of anger and hostility this car has caused in the Mini community, the community is a large part of what makes a Mini.

Either way this turns out I feel this single development is a pivot point in the time line of Mini. It could be a good move or a bad move. I feel it will sell well but at the same time do more than a little damage. It will be interesting to watch either way.

It does make me chuckle that while Mini is spending so much time and effort with this more and more heavy direct competition is coming to the US against its largest production (the Cooper/Cooper S). Makes me wonder if Mini has realized it needs to grow since its best selling market is being invaded by more cars that have already caused it sales loss in Europe?

By: bavarian racing green

bavarian racing green — Sun, 12 Jul 2009 16:15:09 +0000

...the answer Jon PD, is 'no' as I hardly believe that BMW will compete on there entire lineup with themselves...

...this model makes sense with the intro of the X1 (financially) and there is still enough divergence in these iterations for folks to differentiate...

...plus I think the intention is to sell more of these stateside as I don't believe the X1 is really meant for us, but europe instead...

...I will be first in line, so that we can be a 'miini-only' family...

...thanks, gabe for speaking up about the trolling...

...I fully understand and appreciate why people don't and do like decisions made by MINI/BMW however, constant blind dissent is just as misguided and condescending as unfounded incessant praise...

By: JonPD

JonPD — Sun, 12 Jul 2009 15:43:17 +0000

Guess my question still would be if tomorrow I adopt three kids or need six seats does this mean Mini should make a larger car for me. I know that many people do need the extra room for a larger family and fully accept this, I fail however to think that the brand needs to fill every need of every possible owner. I would much rather have Mini keep a very clear brand image that doesn't end up tarnishing the rest of the brand. I am not sure if this will be the case of not but I do believe its a real possibility.

As for a R60 on the Dragon, yep it will happen after a chunk of aftermarket tuning to make the extra mass and inertia of this car perform with the same grace of the coupe. Then again, just because I can spend the money to make a school bus cut around the Dragon doesn't mean its a Mini.

To me the handling and feel of the R60 is going to be interesting. The Clubman is already a little less stable than the Coupe in default configurations. You can feel the extra mass it carries load into the corners. I somewhat shudder at what many extra hundreds of pounds will feel like. I do have trust in BMW/Mini to make a capable car just wonder at the end of the day if it will truly be a Mini.

By: Thameth

Thameth — Sun, 12 Jul 2009 09:36:48 +0000

@JonPD:

I bet you we will see pictures from KillBoy of the R60 running the Dragon soon enough since the car is already in the states, they will definitely do some testing there.

Its a real shame that our Nissan Murano Lease ends in Sept, I wish I could extend it till the R60 is released and then convince the wife to get it as her daily. But she's just not into the MINI, she's dying for a 328i.... baaah