Sources at Car and Driver are saying that MINI chief and former BMW M division boss, Dr. Kay Segler, has very real aspirations to finally turn the John Cooper Works into the stand-alone, performance skunkworks that frankly, we’ve always wanted it to be. We’ve heard this from MINI before, but with Dr. Kay at the helm, will the dream finally come true? What could this mean for future JCW MINI models? Details after the break.
First of all, Dr. Kay wants to push JCW beyond packages and accessories and produce stand-alone MINI JCW models — just like BMW’s M cars.
Once the JCW Countryman arrives, MINI will offer John Cooper Works packages for all of its models, but Segler wants to further differentiate JCW products in the future. This means that cars wouldn’t so much be equipped with the John Cooper Works package, but rather positioned as standalone models.
Mini already considers the standard JCW powerplant—a turbocharged 1.6-liter four making at least 208 hp—a “unique” engine, and not a standard Cooper S mill with more boost. But we interpret Segler’s remarks to mean that the John Cooper Works engine will come in for additional work in the future; that could mean it will get some unique internals, or that the displacement will be increased. Segler’s sentiments also suggest that more hard-core, limited-edition models like the upcoming new-gen MINI GP could be produced.
Could the next generation MINI GP be the first in a whole generation of stand-alone JCW cars? That’s a thrilling prospect to say the least. But if the John Cooper Works does start producing independent models, will any of us mere mortals be able to afford one?
Even though Minis have a real penchant for getting absurdly expensive with options and accessories—see our $46,244, ex-long-term JCW convertible as a prime example—Segler says the company will be careful about pricing future John Cooper Works offerings. Take a note from the relatively reasonable pricing of the BMW 1-series M and M3 GTS, we’re told. Considering that the 1-series M was something of a bargain at $47,010, that’s encouraging.
That’s highly encouraging. What good is a line of halo cars if they can only sell a handful? But perhaps the best thing that would come from a more dedicated JCW would be cars that much more highly tuned for performance. If past MINI models are the guidepost, two examples come to mind. The 2006 JCW GP, and the JCW version of the new MINI Coupé (which was designed as the “default” version of the car). Both cars are examples of MINIs that have been developed with a lot of focus. The result in both cases is a car with that little bit more — that little extra bit of feel, performance and refinement. If JCW gets to package each of its models this way, the result is likely to be really, really good.
[Source: Car and Driver Blog]
<p>Interesting that Segler is taking JCW in this direction, and while his back is turned at BMW M, they are taking it completely in the opposite direction. </p>
<p>???</p>
<p>BMW M is putting the M badge on range of diesel cars including SUVs. They are marketing the cars as “BMW M Performance Vehicles” and leaving it up to consumers to appreciate the difference between these cars and the true “bespoke” purpose-built M cars like the 1M, M3, M5 etc. These new diesel cars will be utterly fantastic cars, certainly, but forever changing what the M brand stands for in the marketplace. </p>
<p>On a more positive note, JCW should do well under Segler. These new JCW cars will be amazing if he pulls off something similar to what he achieved at BMW M with the 1M.</p>
<p>Oh sorry I forgot to say. Segler was head of BMW M until last year when he moved over to MINI.</p>
<p>He actually moved back to MINI.</p>
<p>Doctors know best…</p>
<p>I still don’t see how this will change things much. So they might have factory JCW “halo / M like” cars in the future, but still offer JCW “packages” for all the non-JCW cars? How is that different from now?</p>
<p>MINI have watered down the JCW brand by offering everything JCW to any Cooper with little differentiation between a factory-JCW and a Cooper S with JCW package and I don’t see how this will change much in the future.</p>
<p>…Signed a happy but slightly annoyed 2012 <em>factory</em> JCW Hatch owner…</p>
<p>MINI, great to hear more focus will be put on the costly JCW. Having sold them for a few years, I recommend something be done about the pricing to bring it down to competitive levels. A $40,000 MSRP on a MINI just makes buyers look elsewhere to spend their $40k.</p>
<p>The JCW cars need to be more visually distinct from lesser models. Not just a badge and a few stripes, I am talking 1-series to 1M visual difference. Wider wheel arches, body kits and unique wheels.</p>
<p>I just downloaded an image of a 135i and a 1M, and have decided that I have much less discriminating taste than Bimmerphiles. I see a difference in profile here and there, but nothing so exciting or distinctive. I assume the $7,000 difference in price has more to do with the mechanicals….</p>
<p>Read the review on BimmerFile and note that the founder of MotoringFile waited five years because they thought the 7k was worth it.</p>
<p>Requited love is a good thing.</p>
<p>Really? The 1M has huge fender flares, bespoke 19″ wheels, much more aggressive front fascia and out back the signature M four pipe exhaust. Very few people would mistake it for a 135, especially in Valencia Orange which is a 1M only color.</p>
<p>Really? I have a 135 and I only see slight differences, the ones you listed are about it.</p>
<p>The JCW should look different, in more ways then just a badge. At the same time costs need to be reasonable. Even now the MINI is rather overpriced (IMHO) and having a pure JCW at an even more inflated price will be ridiculous!</p>
<p>Hmm…this also means that an even it will cost even more than the current JCW !
And how much is really too much? </p>
<p>This move would be incredibly wise in my view. JCW’s have really lacked feeling truly anything more than a upgrade kit (the GP excluded). I had really wished that MINI would have leveraged this direction after the GP in 2006. Its criminal to me that with a small investment a stock R56/R58 can look the part of a JCW due to the lack of visual separation. As a owner of a GP, and a JCW Coupe still have to say they are light years apart. I respect the R56/R58 JCW for what they are but both still feel like a second thought at MINI. A GP mrk2 should be used to finally evolve JCW into being more than a tiny bit of MINI. It would be interesting but its my assumption that currently there are actually no dedicated JCW staff but rather people like Dr. Kay that are MINI people that work on JCW product. I think part of what has made ///M is the unique nature of it being its own division in BMW.</p>
<p>Adding a cheer that we may be stepping closer to a new measure of respect for JCW. If they turn out a GP type of R58 I will be adding it in a heartbeat no matter the cost! Have confirmed that my dealer knows this and as soon as they are willing to take a deposit I will gladly spend the funds to show my support for JCW evolving into being something that a great many people have longed for for a great many years.</p>
<p>The JCW kit for the R53 came to MINI dealers, I think around 2004. I had my ’03 R53 for about a year until the kit came out. $5300 for parts, plus additional labor charges to go from 163hp to 200hp. Eventually you could order the JCW parts installed when ordering your new Cooper S, which probably cut out some of those labor costs. When the R56 was developed, JCW developed kits for these engines. Until 2007, JCW was seperate from MINI, kind of like how Dinan is to BMW. This makes sence of your thought that JCW was actually a second thought at MINI. The R56 was already on the streets by the time MINI purchased JCW. Developing a JCW model with it’s own heart and sole like a BMW M model would take a few years, maybe delivering something around a mid-life R56 refresh.
The next generation JCWs should be pretty awesome. Instead of spending an extra $5k to beef up a 1.5L 3-cylinder, I’d guess that it would be powered by at least a 2.0L 4-cyclinder with a little more cost, but plenty more bang for you buck. Let’s hope so!</p>
<p>The best thing about my JCW is the brembo brake set-up. I could definitely use a lot more horse power (kind of lacking imo) and all wheel or rear wheel drive. </p>
<p>BTW, I’m selling my JCW Convert for 24k on ebay if anyone is interested. Only 17900 miles!</p>
<p>Under-powered car with good brakes for sale!</p>
<p>The shoe fits. The Doc was probably the guy standing in the way of the M badge being diluted as it is today ; he’s gone from there and look what’s happening (not that I think where’s they’re going with it all is all that bad; but anyway…). And he’s now going to give JCW a step-up in all manners to make it more differentiated from a base car, on the level of a step-up to an M. … the shoe fits.</p>
<p>uhhhh…. $47,000 a bargain for the 1M????…. sure, if you compare it to the M3! Is MINI a BMW? Overall, MINI is steadily creeping towards bigger (clubman, countryman anyone?) and more expensive. Performance aside, when a MINI is costing as much as a Bimmer, then I know they jumped the shark… or has it already happened?…</p>
<p>I paid close to $40K for my loaded ’09 JCW … and they only gave me stock suspension and body-kit as I wasn’t paying more for those. I’d say there’s an argument for saying “yes” (tho I’m not sure that particular cliche fits).</p>
<p>MINI really should move forward with this, JCW needs a major shot in the arm for relevance in the market I think. With the recent news of the Mark5 GTI going with a aluminum roof and over all 100lbs loss. 230HP with 260lbs of torque it does one up the quasi efforts of JCW so far. My hopes would be for them to start the JCW brand over with the proposed GP2 and then at the 2013/2014 redesign they really break this sub brand loose. Still think the major change is that ///M has its own leaders and engineers while I think JCW is mixed with the standard brand. In ways I would almost love to see them leave JCW as the kit name and develop something new for the performance brand as there has been a decade of basically very mixed message about what JCW is within the brand.</p>