Sam’s Club to offer Electric MINI

LannyMCS Dec 5th, 2007 Link

Hmmm…….0-60 in under 5 seconds….imagine how quick it would be if they ditched the S-Heavies :/

b4mmy Dec 5th, 2007 Link

hydrogen fuel is the way to go… once we can sort out the storage and containment

Victor Dec 5th, 2007 Link

@b4mmy

There are lots of viable options already for storage and containment. Unfortunately it is the US government and the Oil Companies that do not start the hydrogen revolution. Also the electricity needed and the costs of it would require a complete shift to Nuclear Power to make it possible.

You can drive from Berlin the Munich on Hydrogen and buy Hydrogen 3 and 7 series BMW’s in Germany from a dealer. There is even a Hydrogen high way beging build in Canada’s west.

http://www.hydrogenhighway.ca/

Motoring advisor Dec 5th, 2007 Link

OK so where do I sign? Do you have to be a Sams club member to buy one?

Jon Dec 5th, 2007 Link

If you go to the Sam’s Club catalog, it lists the 0-60 time to be “Under 9 seconds”.

That is quite a bit different than the claimed 5 seconds… So, which one is right? DB or Gabe?

nervous Dec 5th, 2007 Link

Are they really using a R53?

jas cooper Dec 5th, 2007 Link

It’s a lot cheaper than the one Blunt trashed…

jas cooper Dec 5th, 2007 Link

From Sam’s Club? Does it have a label that says “Batteries Not Included”?

PaulGraz Dec 5th, 2007 Link

Because it’s from Sams club you can’t just buy one, you have to buy a 24-pack… :-)

DB Dec 5th, 2007 Link

From what I have read, 0-60 is closer to the 5 second mark than 9 in this car. But I haven’t seen any testing done, only reported stats.

zm Dec 5th, 2007 Link

if u understand the technologies, then u know h2 won’t work for many, many, many decades.

besides, unless you’re producing h2 from solar electrolysis, you’re breaking hydrocarbon chains at the refinery to get h2. so, all you’re doing is pushing pollutants from cars further up the chain, back to the refinery = still tons of co2 emitted at the refinery.

obviously, the major prob compared to plug-in electric cars is fuel distribution. we already have power lines everywhere for electric car charging. we don’t have an ‘h2 grid’ for fuel cell cars–and there won’t be one for a very long time. the problems for h2 distribution are immense.

not to mention the energy inefficiency of having to compress h2 to 10,000psi just to get 250-mi on a tank. might as well use that energy to charge more energy efficient plug-in cars.

sure there is h2 tech on the horizon, but much further off than the battery tech needed to make plug-in’s feasible. if we get super cap’s to work anytime soon, then there will be no point in going h2–but, that’s a ways down the road, as well. for now, at least we can trade in a used up pack of hundreds of laptop batteries for recycle/regeneration.

again, just way too energy inefficient to produce, distribute & store h2–esp, if u’r hoping to use renewables.

zm Dec 5th, 2007 Link

@ Victor
or, if u’r making h2 from nuclear, like you said.

but, then we have to decide as a society do we spend all that money on building nuclear plants or improving solar & wind tech? unfortunately, the power companies lobbying congress would like to keep us all on the grid, whether it’s coal or nuclear.

so, back to the mini talk, for i want one of these charged by solar or wind. some day….

dave Dec 5th, 2007 Link

as far as hydrogen, honda is going to start leasing a hydrogen fuel cell vehicle next year. it debuted at the la autoshow and will be leased to consumers at $600/month. but i agree, it’s not a viable alternative fuel for mass production/market yet for the same reasons zm cited

Jon Dec 5th, 2007 Link

An interesting development, if Sam’s Club is thinking about offering something like this they must have a strong feeling about the viability of this. Think any move towards greener production has a thumbs up from me. Still the one sad fact is a large portion of the energy being produced in the US is from coal so in effect even though not all of these cars would be directly ran from coal plants I expect the production of energy to increase across the power grid at most plants to offset new usage.

Still think the things I’ve herd about the Tesla roadster are more interesting. One of the concepts they have is to start selling solar panels large enough to allow their owners to completely offset the energy off the public grid.

zm Dec 5th, 2007 Link

a good point, jon. garbage in, garbage out.

YuccaPatrol Dec 5th, 2007 Link

Exactly Jon!

Here in Alabama, we have what might be the dirtiest coal burning power plants in the country.

An electric MINI powered by coal is almost certainly more harmful to the environment than my current gas guzzling MCS.

Jon Dec 5th, 2007 Link

Then that solves it: gasoline is the wave of the future!

MINIme Dec 5th, 2007 Link

It aint easy, or cheap, being green!

I say the MINI community should all go green. Let’s all trade up or convert. We (in the USA) could get together, build a giant pipeline that runs coast to coast and pump sea water to desalination/fueling stations all over the country. And then, using H2O, converted to hydrogen, we could run our MINIs until the wheels fell off. Not only could we fill up our cars with a garden hose, we could all but eliminate emmissions (or at least cancel out those nasty ol’ SUVs) and lower the sea levels to counteract all that global warming. CA and FL would be saved until the next wildfire or hurricane and we would all have the warm fuzzies. I’ll take my water powered, hydrogen-fuel cell MINI in green.

Sign me up.

zm Dec 5th, 2007 Link

I know there was some sarcasm there, but here are some interesting numbers:

http://www.evworld.com/news.cfm?newsid=16664

confirm at will…

zm Dec 5th, 2007 Link

a little more info:

http://www.evworld.com/evguide.cfm

surprised Hybrid Tech isn’t kicking out info like this. but, here’s their spin on ev vs h2:

http://www.hybridtechnologies.com/lithium/why_electric

MINIme Dec 5th, 2007 Link

OK, I’ll take electric. In electric Lime green!!

MINIme Dec 5th, 2007 Link

…with a solar-powered roof!

I am totally serious! Sarcastic, but serious. Not seriously sarcastic. (8P)

petsounds Dec 5th, 2007 Link

I didn’t know Sam’s Club was in the habit of selling cars… I thought they were mostly a grocery wholesaler. And who is this MINI waranteed under? Has this been done with MINI’s blessing? I would imagine this would nullify most of the MINI’s warranty. Also, it looks like they’re using the R53-model Cooper S…interesting.

sandm4130 Dec 5th, 2007 Link

Hey “zm” you seem more knowledgeable than I on this subject.

Why is there no mention of the validity of bio-fuels in your statements?

Just curious.

Thanks,

zm Dec 5th, 2007 Link

short answer, bio-fuels are another lost cause (with one exception).

long answer, bio-fuels are something the bush admin is pushing for non-environmental reasons. mostly, to keep crop prices high–if you know all the ties b/n the gov, ag industry, farm bill, developing country subsidies, etc, then you know what i’m talking about. (and, in my opinion the reason they’re pushing h2 is just to give them some green cred even though they know it’s a pipe dream that doesn’t threaten their oil & gas buddies at this point.)

as far as their enviro impact, ethanol produces less tailpipe co2, but has been shown to have worse smog emissions = worse cases of asthma in inner-city children (which right now most of those cases come from the super dirty version of diesel we burn in the US).

then there’s where you’re getting the ethanol from… corn ethanol processing is very energy intensive & becomes a wash in overall co2 emissions. u’re just kicking them further up the chain from the tailpipe to the processing plant. not to mention, where are you going to find enough corn to satisfy our driving habits? plus, you’d starve half of the developing world as corn ethanol prices increased just so americans can drive their cars.

sugar ethanol processing (brazil) is a decent bit more efficient than corn ethanol processing, but still kicks out more co2 than elec cars running on coal electricity.

then there’s cellulosic ethanol–some real promise there. just google for details. but again, you’re still using a combustion engine so you’re still going to have a decent # of emissions as more & more cars come onto the road.

so, if you’re going to combust, all you can do is make engines more efficient. what’s laughable about that is most of the appreciable technologies that make them more efficient just turn them off & run other forms of power (hybrids, batteries, fuel cell apu’s, start/stop idling, etc). so, you’re making a very inefficient process as efficient as possible by using it as little as possible–seems stupid. a loosing game that can never be won.

then, why do we use hydrocarbons? HC’s are the only energy source that’s abundant and dense enough to satisfy our energy demands. if you want to stop the problems that come along w/ burning HC’s, you have to curtail use (which will never happen, unless gas hits $20/gal) or find another energy source.

the only other energy sources that are abundant enough to meet out demands are nuclear & solar (and possibly some new wind tech that’s in testing)–there is absolutely nothing else. in both cases you need electric cars. the only real hurdle to the electric car gets back to energy density. batteries can’t store enough energy to last 250mi (unless it’s a tiny tesla or mini)–impractical in the US. so, we have to wait for better battery tech or super capacitors or something else.

anyways, lots of pieces to the puzzle.

BRUCE HORD Dec 6th, 2007 Link

Diesel is here, available NOW, and achieves huge fuel savings, and is not limited to a 100 mile range.

Why are we discussing a technology that currently is hugely expensive and achieves very limited results?

Bottom line, why doesn’t MINI offer the diesel version in Yankee land now?

Mark sells MINi's Dec 6th, 2007 Link

My brain hurts…

Jon Dec 6th, 2007 Link

I personally believe that there is no one technology that will solve our problems. I am happy to see any green technology being sold as even if its a small step in the right direction its better than staying static or even falling further behind. I hope this car sells well for them as every time successfully builds like this are made I am sure it will catch BMW/Mini’s attention.

agranger Dec 6th, 2007 Link

Anyone else wonder why they are starting with a MCS when they are just going to replace the motor anyway? The better suspension bits can be ordered a la carte…

DB Dec 6th, 2007 Link

Bottom line, why doesn’t MINI offer the diesel version in Yankee land now?

We’ve discussed this, at length already. Check out This post for the why.

Jon Dec 6th, 2007 Link

Good question agranger!

Maybe is just for the go-fast mail slot

MINIme Dec 6th, 2007 Link

I want a diesel now. Why wait? I know, I know…because the masses in the USA won’t buy it. Too slow, etc., etc. When the good ol’ USofA finally mandates cleaner-burning diesel fuel, and it becomes readily available, I will be driving a diesel powered vehicle.

karlInSanDiego Dec 6th, 2007 Link

Walmart is not really a valuable part of the story. Think Neiman Marcus Christmas Catalog: 2008 Gift Lexus
Interestingly, NM Lexus is about the same price.

When Hybrid Technologies choose to offer their first cars for sale this way, it gives them a simple way to test that price point without exposing themselves to an angry eco-mob due to an unfulfillable waitlist. These are undoubtedly extremely limited quantity. Frankly, there’s no proof that Hybrid Technologies is ready to sell a production car, but this is a novel way for them to test their metal. I wish them the best. I’m a firm believer that lithium ion powered electrics plus solar and wind clean home power generation will be the future of the motorcar. While $65 seems extreme, the LI battery technology is still relatively bleeding edge. It’ll be MUCH cheaper very soon.

karlInSanDiego Dec 6th, 2007 Link

Actually, fine print says Sam’s Club’s not offering it for sale at all. This EV MINI is strictly being advertised for direct purchase from Hybrid Technologies.