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What automatic will MINI use in the F56? That’s the question I asked MINI USA Head of Product Pat McKenna last week when MINI USA brought MotoringFile to its US Headquarters to discuss the F56’s technology. The response was unexpected; the current 6 Speed Aisin automatic. The immediate follow-up was, why would MINI stick with the six speed when competitors are moving to 8 and 9 speed quick-shifting automatics?
The answer was straightforwart. According to Mr. McKenna, MINI is happy with the performance of the Aisin unit for the time being. With some mechanical revisions and totally revamped software, MINI believes the updated transmission will keep pace with the industry – including the VW GTI’s six speed DSG (which is a DTC or dual clutch transmission).
When pressed a bit more about the effeciency gains to be had with with the new generation of 8-9 speed autos, Mr. McKenna mentioned that a new automatic could be on its way in the future didn’t make sense at this time. if we had to guess, that transmission would likely debut in the next generation Countryman in a few years time. That would also coincide with the refresh of the F56 in 2017. But we’re getting ahead of ourselves a bit.
The moment I heard the Aisin auto was sticking around I thought of the thousands of MotoringFile readers who would likely be disappointed. And while we’re right there with you, all is not lost. Based on what we heard last week at MINI HQ, we expect the new Sport Auto version of the Aisin unit (a $250 option) to be surprisingly effective. There are three reasons for this:
– The optional Sport Auto has further enhanced software that allows for quicker shifts and more aggressive reactions
– The optional Launch Control will officially make the Aisin automatic faster than the manual in both the Cooper and Cooper S.
– The completely redesigned interior boasts pull-pull paddles finally ditching the push-pull design which seemed catered to latte drinkers more than enthusiasts.
And what about DCT in the future? We’d wager MINI will never go DCT. In fact, based on industry trends and sources, we believe the DCT will be a technology mainly tied to one company with a massive investment already made in the technology; VW. With ZF producing 8 and 9 speed autos that rival the DCT in shift speed and rev matching, all while providing a much more refined experience, there’s simply a better choice out there. Couple this with the new generation of automatics being decidedly more efficient than the DCT and writing is on the wall. In fact MINI’s parent company BMW already has made that choice; every 2014 BMW but M models (which are too torque rich for the auto) are now equipped with the excellent 8 speed ZF unit.
All this means we fully expect MINI to move to a 8 or 9 speed automatic in the next generation Countryman and refreshed F56. In the meantime we’ll withhold judgement on the revised Aisin six speed until we drive the F56 in late January.
And if all else fails, MINI’s revised six speed manual with rev-matching sounds pretty tempting to us. In fact it makes us wonder why we’re even worried about automatics.
<p>If you buy an automatic, you deserve whatever automatic you get. I know on one of the recent WRR episodes, y’all were talking about the hassle of manually shifting in heavy traffic, but you know what? Shifting in traffic is a <em>little</em> annoying, for as long as the traffic last. An Automatic is boring ALL THE TIME.</p>
<p>For the record that was no me talking about a hassle. I drive a manual into Chicago every day and have zero complaints.</p>
<p>I thought it was DB and Nate, regarding DB buying a new car.</p>
<p>There’s no Nate on the show.</p>
<p>Sure there is. Heavyset guy who sounds like he’s gargling a ham sandwich.</p>
<p>DB encountered some genuinely bumper-to-bumper traffic and made a small case for the auto. I’m with you though, manual is fine. Leave some room between you and the car in front of you and you can often just stay in first and crawl on the torque.</p>
<p>Did that for many years and it works. But guess what? Clutches wear out at a higher rate in daily bumper to bumper traffic. Replacing the clutch in a MINI is nor easy or cheap job, requiring pretty much complete dissassembly of the front end and 9-11 hours total labor.
I am totally over stick shift cars. I am glad I got to drive them and experiecing them not only in MINIs but other cars throught the years. But I don’t see myself buying another 3-pedaled car ever again, unless, I move to a rural/deserted area with great roads where to enjoy it. But here in crowded pancake flat Florida, forget it.</p>
<p>In South Florida no one wants manual transmission cars. The traffic here is horrendous. And yes, I drove manual transmission MINIs here for well over 10 years. The average speed of city traffic here is a whooping 23 MPH as per the on board computer. Same as high powered cars (300HP +), manual transmissions are wasted in this environment and have little to poor resale value. When I was selling my R53 last year, most of the inquiries came from out of state buyers. An automatic MINI (Or car anything here) is easier to sell privately and fetches higher trade in value as well. Manual transmission sedans here end up in auctions and shipped out to other states or out of the country.</p>
<p>Resale values in the land of retirees. You really strike at the very heart of motoring excitement, don’t you Francis?</p>
<p>Yes many of the geritrol set here drive Porsches, Aston Martins, Buggatis, Ferraris, Bentleys, Maseratis, Lambos and others. You should see them hauling ass in and around Miami and enjoying all that power right under their Depends….</p>
<p>So it’s impossible to have fun in a car where you live. Got it.</p>
<p>In your shoes, I think I might sign off of the MINI website and go look at the C-Max. It’s not fun, but it’s very capable and gets good mileage (though less than Ford claims).</p>
<p>I live in South Florida and have a manual R53 and E89.</p>
<p>Manual transmission is Never a waste if you like to drive your car.</p>
<p>If you’re physically able to use a manual, there will never be more useful option for your car. I guess I don’t buy a car to worry about resale.</p>
<p>This attitude is extremely frustrating when you’re medically unable to drive a manual. Seriously, get over yourself.</p>
<p>I can’t see how your medical problem relates to either of my positions. Let’s check.</p>
<p>1) If you buy an automatic, you deserve an automatic.</p>
<p>2) Manuals are more fun.</p>
<p>Nope. Can’t see how the particulars of your situation, whatever they may be, have any impact on the validity of those two statements. Honestly, the first one is essentially a tautology, which makes it both kinda pointless AND unassailable. The second is a matter of opinion, therefore impossible to either prove or disprove, but I think I’ve at least got public sentiment on my side.</p>
<p>It’s hard not to be a little disappointed. I quite fancied a Cooper S with an 8- or 9-speed transmission, partly for the performance and economy benefits and partly for having the latest technology. I now think that I’ll opt for the manual version, at least it comes with a cool feature to help downshifts, and it will be more fun. And I get to own a manual for another three years.
It seems the Cooper may actually be the pick of the range: a lightweight three cylinder and 170 lb Ft torque (on overboost) with normal maximum torque available from a low 1250rpm. That should feel quick around town.
I’m also encouraged by the torque figures of the Cooper S. 189hp seems low, but 221 Ib Ft of torque on overboost is plenty, and one hopes it will feel noticeably quickly than the Cooper too.</p>
<p>rip mini</p>
<p>So its literally the exact same aisin unit as the r56 r60 has? Therfore with ecu upgrades a rev match and launch control is possible in a r56-r61?</p>
<p>I was fine with the 6 speed auto….until they said there is a $250 option to make it better with software. It costs them the same to develop that no matter which one you buy so why not give you the “good” automatic? I would buy the manual anyway (I’ve got an R53 manual, and a Regal GS manual). But it sounds like MINI charging you more because you’re an enthusiast and that just seems wrong.</p>
<p>Hello 🙂
I want to buy a BMW 216d, and it is available with automatic transmission 6 speed, which is used in mini. Do you know if this automatic transmission is good? I had a passat with DSG and it was awesome, but I don’t know if this one is fast, or if it has some delay as the older automatic transmissions of bmw.</p>
<p>Product differentiation from 1 series?</p>
<p>Does this mean that the next 1 series (FWD) will have a 6 speed auto as well?</p>
<p>Probably. It certainly won’t have the HP9 gearbox. That’s only supplied to Land Rover at present, but Chrysler is next in line for this nine-speed auto gearbox, followed by BMW in due course.</p>
<p>And there is the problem- LR paid a boat load for exclusive rights, and Chrysler has a JV of sorts with ZF in the states…. BMW does not have the buying power or willingness to commit large sums of money on “exclusives” for the MINI lineup.</p>
<p>The other problem is production capacity. Currently the Gray Court Factory can only produce 400,000 units of the 9HP gearbox annually, but will eventually be able to produce 800,000 units once up to full production capacity. So other car makers like BMW will, in the meantime, just have to wait in line, It should be worth the wait though. The 9HP is only 0.24 of an inch longer than the 6-speed auto, but weighs 16.5lbs less, and has been designed specifically for transverse FWD/4WD applications, so it will be ideal for the UKL1 architecture, that is in MINI 3 and the next generation BMW 1-series and 2-series. If I understand it correctly, the 9HP’s patented twin dog clutches enable up to two ratios to be omitted when changing either up or down through the gearbox, rather than having to change gears sequentially as with conventional auto boxes. It’s worth mentioning that the 8HP auto gearbox, currently used by BMW, was designed for longitudinal RWD/4WD applications.</p>
<p>Um, if 6 speed autos met the needs of the industry there wouldn’t be 8 and 9 speed autos. The technical reason one could live on with a 6 speed has to due with the very wide torque band of the variable valve timing turbo motors. This allows one to use wider gear spacing without falling off the torque curve so you can still have good performance and continuous thrust. That’s I’d buy…. But there were some 9 speed MINIs running around (converted by the transmission company, not MINI, if I remember correctly). To ignore the demonstrated efficiency gains of the increased number of gears just doesn’t pass the sniff test….</p>
<p>More like, with the already delivered high efficiency of the engine AND improving and optimizing the shifting strategy (read tune the software), they are hitting their MPG targets. So why spend more? But it makes one wonder what one could do with a 9 speed and some hot software….. 5 gears of close ratio for sport and four more for efficiency? Now that’s a recipe to optimize the torque of the motors that could lead to some serious automatic fun.</p>
<p>And piffle to all those who have the time to talk down on autos. They have their place and as I get more exposed to them on the track, there are a lot of benefits to be had with a good auto, even in performance driving situations. It’s not all loss, but rather a trade (more time with hands on the wheel traded for less engaging pedal work). Whatever works for whomever buys the car is all good!</p>
<p>Completely agree.</p>
<p>There ARE good automatics out there. But the Aisin, in its current form, isn’t one. Won’t know if software is enough to make it one until I drive an updated one. But I have serious doubts.</p>
<p>There are 9 speeds… the issue is that BMW does not have the rights to that box until LR’s agreement runs out; followed by Chrysler. Not worth an extra 2k per unit as MINI is small time and BMW’s FWD is a bit out still.</p>
<p>Hmm…I’m not sure I buy the comment that the dual-clutch transmission is basically a big bet by one company. Just because VW is huge doesn’t mean that they are the only ones investing in a double-clutch automatic as the superior way to go, particularly when performance is a priority (is MINI not in the business of making sporty performance cars?).</p>
<p>Nissan, Mercedes, Ferrari, McLaren, Mitsubishi, Renault, and even BMW offer dual-clutch transmissions in their lineups. There have been plenty of ancient torque-converter style automatic transmissions that can handle large gobs of torque (think AMG), but are either lazy in shift response, or poor in efficiency. I have no doubt that the ZF is an improvement in these areas, but given the option…I’d think that the engineers of the 458, 12C, M3/M4, GTR, etc. have chosen the dual-clutch for a really good reason.</p>
<p>Does the MINI Cooper NEED a dual-clutch setup to be fun? No, probably not. But the Aventador and Astons aside, it’s hard to imagine any performance car praised for it’s driving characteristics that currently doesn’t have a Dual-clutch transmission for its automatic offering.</p>
<p>Due to a back issue in the family, manual is out of the question.</p>
<p>My biggest concern about the autobox is the longevity…the horror stories on NAM scare the hell out of me.</p>