The First Electric MINI?

johnnie Apr 21st, 2005 Link

sure would like to know the conversion cost, as gasoline rises an electric would be great for the city

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Bob Womack Apr 21st, 2005 Link

Tell me about the S variant… ;)

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Gabe Apr 21st, 2005 Link

Conversion costs? I’m thinking well more than the cost of the car.

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CraigE Apr 21st, 2005 Link

Its not exactly zero emissions. Its an electric car using rechargable batteries. The electricity to charge those batteries has to come from somewhere. There are relatively few power plants that use: solar, geo-thermal, hydro electric or wind power. That is the only way the car could be truly zero emissions.

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Jack07734 Apr 21st, 2005 Link

Who cares what it costs I want one.

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Francisk Apr 21st, 2005 Link

The charging time is a pain.. it is not as simple as filling up a tank of gas.

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lawrence::otoole Apr 21st, 2005 Link

Hmmm… current range is 100 miles, and the batteries are 210 lbs each. Increasing range means adding batteries – adding one battery is like adding another passenger weight-wise. I wonder how that will affect performance? I wonder if the battery weight is offset by the lightness of the electric motor (if it is lighter than the gas-burners)? I know this thing isn’t going to be a drag racer, but urban transport needs to be quick and agile to be viable…

Heh heh… I too am interested in the S variant!

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Michael Apr 21st, 2005 Link

I could be wrong, but supposedly the torque of any electric car is generally high, and it reaches it’s peak torque immediately…so I’m guessing it wouldn’t be slow off the line by any means.

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TSizemore3 Apr 21st, 2005 Link

One wonders how an electric MINI would fare at an autocross? I would think that the added weight, even if it is down low, would take some of the crispness off the handling.

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dgszweda Apr 21st, 2005 Link

I agree with Craig. It is zero emissions from the strictest sense, but in reality you are just shifting the burden to another emitter of harmful chemicals. Has anyone done a study to see which one is better for the environment. An electric car or a gasoline automobile. Most new automobiles are ULEV, with very low emissions, yet most of the power plants still spew huge clouds of smoke. Let along the toxic batteries filling up landfills.

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TJKonarski Apr 21st, 2005 Link

Well, I can understand your concern about the pollution from the plants. But, most batteries are recycled. I’m not so sure we’d have to be worried about batteries in the landfills.

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Z4MINI Apr 21st, 2005 Link

If the car is FULL electric, you can dispense with the MINIs cast iron engine block, so that weight loss could offset the potential weight gain of the batteries. Weight gain might net out to be very littel.

Also electric motors offer instant torque, so with the right motors you can get fierce acceleration. That is why monster trains are able to accelerate so quickly given their mass. An electric MINI might be able to get around the AutoX course very well indeed.

Finally, the embassy car seems to be powered by lithium batteries, which if I recollect, can be recycled, so an expired battery would not necessarily be filling a landfill.

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Brad Apr 21st, 2005 Link

Lawrence, I’m pretty sure the weight listing is for all the batteries combined.

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James Apr 21st, 2005 Link

Although you are correct about shifting emissions from vehicles to power stations, don’t forget that charging would be done over night, when much electricty is essentially free because it’s not being used. Power stations can’t shut down at night, so a lot of power goes wasted. Harnessing that for our cars is a good idea, and does reduce overall emissions.

The recycling of batteries seems an altogether tougher problem to me.

-James.

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Chris Apr 21st, 2005 Link

Yes, powerplants can shut down at night… some types easily, some not. There is also demand at night, more than you might think.

As for ‘essentially free’, I’ve never gotten a discount on power at night.

Another problem with any power source is the energy and resources required to produce the technolgy, and construct, transport, install it.

I guess it all comes down to “there is no free lunch”. It’s a tired phrase but seems to be built into the fabric of the universe.

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ToplessRed Apr 21st, 2005 Link

With an electric motor, you could in theory dispense with a lot more of an auto’s internals that just the gas engine. For example, instead of 1 big motor/battery, you could use 4 smaller pairs and have them connected directly to the wheels. That means no HP loss from engine to wheel.

Now, whether you can retrofit a MINI to have 4 batteries/motors hooked up directly to each wheel, I dunno. Probably way harder than just replacing the current engine.

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THRAXISjr Apr 21st, 2005 Link

Sign me up! I’ve been talking about this with my wife for a while and if they’re available in the next couple of years we’ll be all over it! I might just keep my MCS ‘03 and pass it down to the kids.

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Bart Apr 21st, 2005 Link

I just don’t understand what all the buzz is over a supposedly eclectic MINI… If you ask me, I think they’re all a bit eclectic as the car design mixes classic British styling with state-of-the-art engineering.. not to mention the individualist mix of colors and options each owner puts together! I looked at the photos and it’s just a BRG Cooper.. what’s so amazingly eclectic about that -? huh-? geez….

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blalor Apr 21st, 2005 Link

Tell me about the S variant… ;)

The S comes with an extra pair of 9-volts. :-)

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Rocketboy Apr 21st, 2005 Link

I hate to say it, but this was news back in September/October…

You can read about it here also…

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Rocketboy Apr 21st, 2005 Link

That’s what I get for trying to be crafty…

http://users.adelphia.net/~rocketboy/2004/10/electric-minis.html

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Grant Apr 21st, 2005 Link

“As for ‘essentially free’, I’ve never gotten a discount on power at night.”

Some power companies have adjustable rates based on the time of day. However, I think mostly it is an increase for midday use rather than a discount for night use.

In any case… an electric MINI would be awesome! Even ‘greener’ for us here in with Hydro-electric power. :)

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Josh Apr 21st, 2005 Link

Electric cars are worse for the global environment because of the terrible energy loss from converting back and forth between energy sources like oil, coal, and natural gas to electricty back to an energy of motion. Unless the electricity comes from a non-polluting, renewable source then it is worse.

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MiniLifeCrisis Apr 22nd, 2005 Link

What’s the 0-60 and 1/4 mile times?

LOL

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electricsCanGoFassssst Apr 22nd, 2005 Link

How about 4 seconds!?

Check out page 20 of this PDF file on the tZero…

http://www.acpropulsion.com/tzeroEVS17Paper.pdf

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dominicminicoopers Apr 22nd, 2005 Link

Wow! Hey, if priced right, I’d buy an electric MINI in a heartbeat!! But unfortunately, hybrids, alternative-fuel and electrics tend to be priced out the pricerange of most people who’d want to drive them.

BTW, that link above to the tZero is killer!

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AlanL Apr 22nd, 2005 Link

Regarding the comments about emissions elsewhere – in the short term, that’s probably true, but supposed you get your electricity from a much more efficient source. You don’t need to retrofit everyone’s cars to reap the benefit.

Also, by that logic, is operating any electric motor off the the electric grid a bigger pollution waste? Like your blender? Or the fans that blow air through your furnace?

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John Apr 26th, 2005 Link

Please do your research before making outlandish comments on how bad an electric car is for the environment. Yes, powerplants produce pollution. But the efficiency comparison between a power plant vs the entire process of getting oil from the ground to powering your car isn’t even close. And, yes, the power plant is MUCH more efficient.

http://www.electroauto.com/info/pollmyth.shtml

“According to the World Resources Institute, EVs recharging from coal-fired plants will reduce CO2 emissions in the country from 17 to 22 percent.”

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Charles S Apr 28th, 2005 Link

Yes, I second John’s comment about researching about EV before claiming that it is more polluting than gasoline cars.

I also want to point out this: Just because it’s easy to connect coal to electricity doesn’t mean that it negates the fact that it takes a lot of energy to refine crude oil to produce gasoline. People who are poo-pooing on EV seems to forget that gasoline does NOT magically appear at the pump. It takes energy to drill, extract, and transport crude oil. Refineries also use electricity to refine the oil to gasoline.

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Randall May 11th, 2005 Link

ELECTRICAL POWER GENERATION If you have a look at the cross-section of electrical power generation, simple logic will tell you that most powerplants, be it hydro, nuclear, natural gas, coal or geothermal run at a predetermined output 24 hours a day. The startup procedures for most large generators are prohibitive, and the risk of a failed start or failed reacceleration is unacceptable.

AUTO vs POWERPLANT EMISSIONS The emissions from relatively tiny numbers of fossil-fuel-powered electrical generating facilities are much more easily controlled than that from millions of automobiles and heavy vehicles. Even if passenger automobiles in the US maintained an emissions system failure rate of 1%, that would mean that there would be 1.6 million heavy polluters running amok . Yikes. And think of the huge amount of pollution CREATED by vehicle emissions testing. It means that millions of vehicle owners in areas where testing is mandatory, have to waste time, energy, and fuel EVERY year or two, to make sure the vehicle is within limits….and then make REPEAT trips when it fails ! Now multiply those efforts by millions of vehicles! Let’s not even discuss the millions of gallons of oil and fuel which enter our environment annually because of losses and accidents during refueling, shipping, vapour losses, and drivetrain leakage. Over 230 million gallons of oil go into landfills each year just from used oil containers and engine oil filters! And much of that oil evaporates as unburned hydrocarbons, which enter the atmosphere and contaminate soil, water, and otherwise breathable air.

Forgive me for getting off the topic for a moment, but I think this whole mess has been allowed to happen because automakers have a stranglehold on the automobile industry, and are powerful marketers. I mean, even COAL could become a better alternative, now that Liquified Coal technology is no longer a fantasy, with particulate emissions far below current coal plants. The whole Internal Combustion – powered automobile thing even makes the combination of conventional coal-fired powerplants and electric vehicles look somewhat appealing! At least you can build the plants well outside the cities, and disperse the emissions.

NUCLEAR – GENERATED POWER and Electric Vehicles

Now, before you get all hot under the collar about the Nuclear alternative, remember one thing; The pollution and global climate shift resulting from our incredible magnitude of fossil-fuel burning, is resulting in unimagineable losses in productivity, environmental quality, and human living standards worldwide. We can blame thick, choking smog, acid rain, dead fish and rivers, deforestation, NOISE pollution, and chemical runoff to a large degree on the operation of huge numbers of Internal Combustion Engines (ICE). If you want some idea as to how many humans have been directly affected physically, mentally, and vocationally by the Billions of tons of pollutants floating around our oceans, lakes, rivers, and atmosphere because of the ICE automobile, begin thinking in the 100’s of MILLIONS of individuals. Bronchitis, Cancer, and Emphysema are only the tip of the iceberg, in terms of human illness. Infant mortality, asthma, cardiovascular problems, and genetic mutation are just a few more effects. Climate change could also have significant indirect health effects, as changes in climate trigger other changes that could affect health. An example would be the transmission of infectious diseases such as malaria, dengue and yellow fever as insects carrying diseases migrate northward.

Now, think about the fact that even with all its bad media over the last 20 years, the thousands of operating-years achieved by nuclear powerplants on land and at sea have been responsible for fewer than 50 deaths. Chernobyl for instance, is now reported as 600-800 total thyroid cancer cases, with only 3 associated deaths in this population. Most (est 95%) of these cancers are treatable with no long term adverse prognosis except the need for routine thyroid medication. There is no excess leukemia in the population. There are cases of leukemia deaths in the high-dose cleanup workers that are considered to be associated with their exposure. These numbers bring the total deaths from Chernobyl to estimates of 42 and ‘less than 50′ (including the original 31 deaths, 28 from acute radiation exposure).

Now, think of what could be achieved if we switched from fossil-fueled vehicles, to electric vehicles powered by the current lithium-ion, Non-toxic battery technology (200+ mile range), recharged at night (~4 hours)with non-polluting, zero–CO2 nuclear energy. Goodbye Kyoto. There are already plug-ins almost everywhere you go. You don’t have to erect a hugely expensive hydrogen-refueling infrastructure ( $50 Billion+ ? ). You don’t need to wait 20+ years for the fuel cell to become affordable, and compact enough ( current demonstration vehicles leave little room for occupants or cargo). We have additional nuke plants in the planning stages as we speak, and the latest technology is virtually accident-free. It’s here. Now. And it could make a world of difference.

Just my rant for today.

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John G. Aug 25th, 2005 Link

Well said Randall. Nuclear Power. You’d be in the dark without us.

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Mark Martino Sep 2nd, 2005 Link

I’m a little late finding this article but I have to say that I’d like to buy an electric Mini or at least convert my Mini to electric. I’m not going to argue the details. I’m an electrical engineer and I’m convinced it’s worth it for me financially and for the environment. I’d prefer that BMW design an electric Mini from the ground up but I’ll take what I can get.

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MotoringFile » Archive » Castagna’s Hybrid MINI Mar 18th, 2006 Link

[...] The First Electric MINI ] MotoringFile [...]

Craig D. Nov 8th, 2006 Link

Electric mini, I love the idea.

Some studies have stated upto 90% less emissions using grid power to charge an EV. I dont know if that is correct but even a 25-50% reduction in emissions would be great for us all, others have stated 20-40% reduction. From what I have read a High voltage electric car would have great accelaration. My country uses coal and hydro to get power so im keen on an electric mini. Bring them on.

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